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Mineral Market Will Crash
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Herr Hammer Draken
#61 - 2012-08-01 11:27:46 UTC
Will Dust require minerals to build stuff for Dust and where will those minerals come from?

The devs want to connect the two games together economically.

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
Sarik Olecar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#62 - 2012-08-01 11:42:40 UTC
Why would anyone think this affect mineral prices? Max Yield isn't increasing, just tank. And this may be shocking, but when you gank a miner, he doesn't stop mining forever. We just reship and start mining again...

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Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#63 - 2012-08-01 11:45:48 UTC
Sarik Olecar wrote:
Why would anyone think this affect mineral prices? Max Yield isn't increasing, just tank. And this may be shocking, but when you gank a miner, he doesn't stop mining forever. We just reship and start mining again...

Have you read any botting forums recently? Hulkageddon causes more tears there than here, and that's saying a lot.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Sarik Olecar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#64 - 2012-08-01 11:54:59 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Have you read any botting forums recently? Hulkageddon causes more tears there than here, and that's saying a lot.

Still don't see how it would affect mineral prices though. Say at most a few hundred ships are ganked every day, and all of them are bots. Then you stopped a few hundred ships from mining for a few hours until their controllers can reset them. Seems like it's just a drop in the bucket compared to the amount traded in Jita daily...

Hows my posting? Call 1-800-747-7633 to leave feedback.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#65 - 2012-08-01 12:00:50 UTC
Sarik Olecar wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Have you read any botting forums recently? Hulkageddon causes more tears there than here, and that's saying a lot.

Still don't see how it would affect mineral prices though. Say at most a few hundred ships are ganked every day, and all of them are bots. Then you stopped a few hundred ships from mining for a few hours until their controllers can reset them. Seems like it's just a drop in the bucket compared to the amount traded in Jita daily...

I think some recent data released by CCP showed something like ~3 billion meters³ of ore is mined per day, with over half coming from high-sec space. Killing normal miners who switch activities (or at least stop mining for a while), and disrupting bot operations, both cause pretty significant decreases in total daily ore intake. Don't forget that the grand majority of Jita mineral transactions are speculative in nature, and as such, daily Jita transactions greatly exceed the actual daily mineral intake from asteroid belts.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Sarik Olecar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#66 - 2012-08-01 12:15:57 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
I think some recent data released by CCP showed something like ~3 billion meters³ of ore is mined per day, with over half coming from high-sec space. Killing normal miners who switch activities (or at least stop mining for a while), and disrupting bot operations, both cause pretty significant decreases in total daily ore intake. Don't forget that the grand majority of Jita mineral transactions are speculative in nature, and as such, daily Jita transactions greatly exceed the actual daily mineral intake from asteroid belts.


You may be right. However, I still don't think the any changes coming from the EHP buff will be enough to offset the changes to drone and mission drops. I wouldn't mind being wrong though, I do miss 30mil Drakes...

Hows my posting? Call 1-800-747-7633 to leave feedback.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#67 - 2012-08-01 12:56:29 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Sarik Olecar wrote:
Why would anyone think this affect mineral prices? Max Yield isn't increasing, just tank. And this may be shocking, but when you gank a miner, he doesn't stop mining forever. We just reship and start mining again...

Have you read any botting forums recently? Hulkageddon causes more tears there than here, and that's saying a lot.


Well don't tease us like that - post the good stuff!

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#68 - 2012-08-01 13:01:56 UTC
Seriously? Even if the prices crash, I don't dare, cause mining will not be such a chore anymore...

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#69 - 2012-08-01 13:05:55 UTC
AdmiralJohn wrote:
I guarantee that along with the influx of minerals will be an influx of mad miners complaining about their precious ISK/hr, and all will be as it should be.


+1 on this.

COO - Bene Gesserit Chapterhouse  CEO - Sanctuary Pact Alliance
Alexzandvar Douglass
Motiveless Malignity
Deepwater Hooligans
#70 - 2012-08-01 13:22:00 UTC
Thing is, people who hate mining and would never mine will still never mine. Mineral prices will never go nuts unless Mining suddenly overnight becomes very interesting.
Wallimiyama
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2012-08-01 13:24:35 UTC
Suddenly Forums ForumKings wrote:
Once CCP introduces the barge changes there will be a massive influx of cheap minerals to the market.

I for one am hoping to return to the glory days of 30m isk drakes. If only tech prices would drop too.

Your isk is about to have more buying power than you could possibly imagine.


"The world will end this afternoon!!! Details on the nightly news at 11 pm."

Derp.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#72 - 2012-08-01 13:25:16 UTC
Alexzandvar Douglass wrote:
Thing is, people who hate mining and would never mine will still never mine. Mineral prices will never go nuts unless Mining suddenly overnight becomes very interesting.

I really see no reason why I shouldn't get a bunch of Mack alts and passively mine as long as I mine enough to buy, say, two PLEXes at the end of the month (one to pay for the account, and another to justify running it). Is this what you guys want? Do you really want a month's worth of daily afk-mining to be worth less than a billion ISK? Because that's what you're going to get.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
#73 - 2012-08-01 13:50:34 UTC
Agree with this assessment. The mineral markets (or at least the high sec minerals) will go downhill fast. Same goes with ice.

Many miners are very independent, and these changes will allow them to be much more effective while still remaining independent. This will slowly flood the market with cheaper and cheaper minerals.

The lack of fear, more so than the actual numerical changes, is what will bring miners back to the fields and drive prices down.


Refiners, T1 manufacturers, mission runners and casual PVPers all stand to gain from this turn of events.


In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse.

Kryss Darkdust
The Skulls
#74 - 2012-08-01 14:00:43 UTC
Pinstar Colton wrote:
Agree with this assessment. The mineral markets (or at least the high sec minerals) will go downhill fast. Same goes with ice.

Many miners are very independent, and these changes will allow them to be much more effective while still remaining independent. This will slowly flood the market with cheaper and cheaper minerals.

The lack of fear, more so than the actual numerical changes, is what will bring miners back to the fields and drive prices down.


Refiners, T1 manufacturers, mission runners and casual PVPers all stand to gain from this turn of events.




Thats the thing that I disagree with, independent miners havent stopped mining. Its just that fewer people are mining because fewer people are playing. Its not a less miners thing related to hulkagedon, its a less players (likely many miners) who simply stopped playing. Now wether its because of hulkagedon or not I suppose is arguable, but it is a fact that today there is roughly 10-20k fewer people playing round the clock than there were a year ago. I mean at peek times a year ago it was not uncommon for me to log in and see 50+ people playing, today I find that during those same times as few as 25k to a max of 40k play today.

I don't see how this change in particular will suddenly bring all those people back to the game.

The reality of Eve is that, if you don't love it like it is today, you should probobly go ahead and unsub. 
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#75 - 2012-08-01 14:03:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Destiny Corrupted
If fewer people are playing, but the proportionality between miners and non-miners remained the same, then the supply-demand function for minerals shouldn't have changed.

Edit: Yes, I know, drone poo and meta 0. We need more concrete data to analyze the situation.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Charles Baker
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#76 - 2012-08-01 14:12:39 UTC
Why can't i hold all these tear threads.
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
#77 - 2012-08-01 15:27:17 UTC
Suicide ganking. Saving the world since forever.
Mr Management
Anger Management
#78 - 2012-08-01 15:34:57 UTC
Anything that gives the game back to the masses and away from Goons gets my vote.
Suddenly Forums ForumKings
Doomheim
#79 - 2012-08-01 20:07:26 UTC
Mr Management wrote:
Anything that gives the game back to the masses and away from Goons gets my vote.


Too bad that he goons are controlling technecium which is definitely not going to be affected by these changes.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#80 - 2012-08-01 20:15:23 UTC
Suddenly Forums ForumKings wrote:
Mr Management wrote:
Anything that gives the game back to the masses and away from Goons gets my vote.


Too bad that he goons are controlling technecium which is definitely not going to be affected by these changes.

I thought CCP was adding Tech alchemy or somesuch (not up on the tech stuff entirely).