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Problem with super nerf - super caps are committed for 23 hours and die if the subcap fleet welps

Author
Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#141 - 2011-10-11 15:02:45 UTC
xxxak wrote:
This nerf = Lose Subcap battle, lose all supers on the field.

So with this nerf, supers can no longer defend themselves from subcaps, so now supers are committed for 23 hours once they cyno in if they lose the subcap battle.

Hypothetically, this means that if you have a 15 man super fleet (mid size alliance), plus 120 sub caps (mid size alliance), and lose the subcap battle, you also just lost all your supers.

Kthxbai. No way a sane super pilot will commit now unless they are 150% sure that they have a winning fleet. EVE is dead.


Nothing is a sure thing in war. If you lose a major part of your fleet, and you can't regroup and rally in some way, you're going to lose. As has been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, fielding a force that size in an active combat zone is a gamble.

Even in RL war, a battleship cannot survive indefinitely against a bunch of frigates without support. It simply isn't possible; the guns won't hit targets that small and fast. Losing your subcaps means that you've lost that support 'cushion', and your capital ships are now vulnerable.

In short:

Don't fly what you can't afford to lose!

I can't get rid of my darn signature!  Oh, wait....

Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
#142 - 2011-10-11 15:17:48 UTC
Anything that stops SCs being solowtfpwnmobiles gets my vote.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#143 - 2011-10-11 18:04:31 UTC
miningtool wrote:
I honestly can't tell if your trolling or if your really just don't know anything about eve online and the ships in it but since I can't tell I will start pointing out mistakes

SUPERCARRIERS CANNOT FIT CLONE VAT BAYS titans and rorqs only


Honest mistake. Didn't they used to be able to back in the day? If not, I stand corrected.

miningtool wrote:
Tracking is based off of transversal vorticity ie a erebus catches your dramiel burning straight at it at 10kps it will still hit it so I thought I would bring this up to point out dreads can hit ships other than capitals


While I am unfamiliar with the "vorticity" mechanic, I never meant to say they couldn't hit non-capital ships. I said moving targets, and I say "moving" pretty comfortably because the chances that someone is going to directly charge a dreadnought that's firing on them are pretty damn slim. Any ship moving in just about any direction has at least SOME transversal "vorticity" component, and for Dreads, any transversal at all on something smaller than a capital ship means you're likely going to miss.

Also, you are not considering the effect that the signature resolution of the guns themselves have. An Ion Siege Blaster Cannon I has a SigRes of 1000m. A dramiel is much smaller than this. This means that even when flying directly towards the Erebus, it will likely miss a good portion of the time.

miningtool wrote:
fighters are being nerfed also they are moving their sig resolution from 125 to 400


The changes were PROPOSED, not concrete. Relax a little. CCP has already admitted this is unfair to carriers and will be leaving fighters alone.

Thanks for pointing out all my mistakes though, i really appreciate it. Sorry I'm not as smart as you!! :-P

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

VIT0 C0RLE0NE
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#144 - 2011-10-11 18:36:18 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
xxxak wrote:
This nerf = Lose Subcap battle, lose all supers on the field.

So with this nerf, supers can no longer defend themselves from subcaps, so now supers are committed for 23 hours once they cyno in if they lose the subcap battle.

Hypothetically, this means that if you have a 15 man super fleet (mid size alliance), plus 120 sub caps (mid size alliance), and lose the subcap battle, you also just lost all your supers.

Kthxbai. No way a sane super pilot will commit now unless they are 150% sure that they have a winning fleet. EVE is dead.


Makes alliance level 0.0 warfare a high-risk thing with massive casualties ... basically good.

If people are too chicken-scared to commit then they don't deserve to hold space.


This. Dont fight scared and you may win battles you thought you were going to lose. It should be an all in fight if you are gonna do it. Thank God there are no more oh s*** we are all gonna die so i should log off to save myself moments. If you cant afford or are too scared of losing a ship you shouldnt fly it. The bold will hold sov, and the pussies will lose it.
Igualmentedos
Perkone
Caldari State
#145 - 2011-10-11 18:41:23 UTC
xxxak wrote:
This nerf = Lose Subcap battle, lose all supers on the field.

So with this nerf, supers can no longer defend themselves from subcaps, so now supers are committed for 23 hours once they cyno in if they lose the subcap battle.

Hypothetically, this means that if you have a 15 man super fleet (mid size alliance), plus 120 sub caps (mid size alliance), and lose the subcap battle, you also just lost all your supers.

Kthxbai. No way a sane super pilot will commit now unless they are 150% sure that they have a winning fleet. EVE is dead.


Big smile please continue to cry MOAR!

Oh, if you decide to quit; can I have your stuff? I think I'm the first to ask, sooo.....
Alxea
Unstable Pirate Sharks Of The Damed Sea
#146 - 2011-10-11 19:39:43 UTC
xxxak wrote:
This nerf = Lose Subcap battle, lose all supers on the field.

So with this nerf, supers can no longer defend themselves from subcaps, so now supers are committed for 23 hours once they cyno in if they lose the subcap battle.

Hypothetically, this means that if you have a 15 man super fleet (mid size alliance), plus 120 sub caps (mid size alliance), and lose the subcap battle, you also just lost all your supers.

Kthxbai. No way a sane super pilot will commit now unless they are 150% sure that they have a winning fleet. EVE is dead.

Risk vs reward!? Must be a new concept for you. Roll
Trainwreck McGee
Doomheim
#147 - 2011-10-11 19:51:07 UTC
I love how OP is complaining.....but to me is explanation of why the changes are good for EVE rofl.

Supercaps are not insta-win button so why fly them? IF all my support is dead then I should still win!!

These are what i hear form OP

CCP Trainwreck - Weekend Custodial Engineer / CCP Necrogoats foot stool

Mfume Apocal
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#148 - 2011-10-11 19:59:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Mfume Apocal
xxxak wrote:
Hypothetically, this means that if you have a 15 man super fleet (mid size alliance), plus 120 sub caps (mid size alliance), and lose the subcap battle, you also just lost all your supers.


why yes, yes it does... problem?

miningtool wrote:
supers were in no shape or form instant win. no one is willing to drop supers on goons and test fleets for a reason we eat them with subcaps now they will just be useless ships that cant hold enough drones


ho ho ho
Alxea
Unstable Pirate Sharks Of The Damed Sea
#149 - 2011-10-11 20:06:22 UTC
xxxak wrote:
This nerf = Lose Subcap battle, lose all supers on the field.

So with this nerf, supers can no longer defend themselves from subcaps, so now supers are committed for 23 hours once they cyno in if they lose the subcap battle.

Hypothetically, this means that if you have a 15 man super fleet (mid size alliance), plus 120 sub caps (mid size alliance), and lose the subcap battle, you also just lost all your supers.

Kthxbai. No way a sane super pilot will commit now unless they are 150% sure that they have a winning fleet. EVE is dead.

So because there was no risk before, they were used all the time and killed like gods, now since there will be risk. Your saying super pilots are just a bunch of scarred little carebears who call themselves pvpers because they can kill anything on the field in one felt swoop and suddenly can't this winter. And your trying to say there was nothing wrong with them being in god mode for years?

That was the whole problem. So now there is risk just like for everybody else in eve they rage quit because now they are no longer in god mode. They cry and flow rivers of tears and cry some more about how they are so mortal now. It is about time! Come down to the same level of all of us and die like real men (And woman) grow some family jewels and suck it up. Stop hiding behind broken overpowered ships and just take risks like everybody else because this is eve and it is all about risk vs reward. It never should have been about god mode online or supercaps online.
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#150 - 2011-10-11 20:26:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Asuka Solo
Alxea wrote:


stuff....

It never should have been about god mode online or supercaps online.


But now its about blob mode online and sub-caps online.

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!

Alxea
Unstable Pirate Sharks Of The Damed Sea
#151 - 2011-10-11 20:26:48 UTC
Thomas Abernathy wrote:
Obsidian Hawk wrote:
so 0.0 people are now complaining that they have to use tactics now?


Here lets break down tactics for the 0.0 people shall we?

Titan bridges in support fleet of recons and battleships to start jamming the enemy fleet.

Carriers and dreads jump in and start pounding the crap out of the enemy capitals.

Finally moms and titans jump in to make quick work of all those pesky triage carriers and the supers take down other supers.

The nerf is just going to make super cap pilots rely on their alliance for help now rather than wheee i have 25 fighter bombers and can kill anything.


Now if you all excuse me i have to go refit a moros and thanatos for battle with target painters.


Laughable. Titans will go back to being bridges, and Motherships will rot on dead accounts.
No one will put one on the field knowing if things go bad, the server farts in the wrong direction and a bunch of his fleet get dc'ed, whatever, he's dead.
The Dread buff alone would have been a good counter and made it harder to field small Super fleets without sufficient support, but as usual, CCP used a hammer instead of a chisel....


Because SC pilots have no balls to commit to a fight and be at risk just live everybody else in the game right?!
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#152 - 2011-10-11 21:26:59 UTC
Asuka Solo wrote:
But now its about blob mode online and sub-caps online.

It was blob mode online before but the blobs were supercaps. I'll take a subcap blob over a supercap blob any day. There can never be too many newbees in rifters...

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Raid'En
#153 - 2011-10-11 22:51:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Raid'En
have a cyno ready somewhere, and try to get your super out of the buble and jump.
if the ennemy can destroy all your subcap fleet, and get all your super bubbled long enough that you can't jump out, you deserve to die.

if you don't like it, then i ask for all my sub cap ships to be able to survive 15mn when i log off on battle. not fair ? then don't ask for your super.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#154 - 2011-10-11 23:23:33 UTC
Wot I Think
Doomheim
#155 - 2011-10-11 23:27:38 UTC
I like this change, OP makes a brilliant point this will be fun Big smile
Caldari Acolyte
Shark Enterprises
#156 - 2011-10-11 23:36:07 UTC
I see some symptoms of IWIN Withdrawal here, don't worry you'll get over it,change is good Blink
Proteus Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#157 - 2011-10-12 00:14:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Proteus Maximus
Speaking for us everyday working slobs who to this point only sat on the side lines reading about glorious fleet battles.. Way to go CCP. Hell I like you now.. you can come to my house and fk my sister.
In closing it's always nice to see folks who bought their way up to the win button get it rammed up their a**.
0 sympathy.

If Goons were around when God said, "Let there be light" they'd have called the light gay, and plunged the universe back into darkness by squatting their nutsacks over it.

cyclobs
Loud Curse Enterprises
#158 - 2011-10-12 01:33:56 UTC
so many tears. i think i'm having a tear overload.


HALP! Lol
Thomas Abernathy
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#159 - 2011-10-12 02:19:35 UTC
With the number of anti-tear posts, you have to wonder just how many people in this game have Supercarrier envy...Oops

The laughable part is, most of the comments come from noob alts who probably have never even seen a SC, much less engaged one. "It's unfair, I can't afford one, so NERF THEM!"

Sandbox filled with mush ? Check.

"Fighting CCD since 2139"

Orlacc
#160 - 2011-10-12 02:31:44 UTC
Draculina Alucardi wrote:
3rd account canceled, no reason to hold an account for a SC pilot, if you can only use it in PVP ... thanks CCP :)



uh

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."