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[FCO] Speech from the Chancery

Author
Tabor Murn
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#21 - 2012-07-19 19:45:38 UTC
I'm glad someone else noticed that little gem hidden amidst the rest Ava.
Valdezi
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#22 - 2012-07-19 23:18:59 UTC
Malcolm Khross wrote:

For the record, Diana Kim isn't Amarrian.


Trust me, she is. She just doesn't know it yet.
Hans Nardieu
Federal Nationalist Party
#23 - 2012-07-19 23:30:01 UTC
The Chancellor's speech has merit - a dream of a universal Federation of humanity, free from anarchy, fear and doubt is surely something worth fighting for.

It is a fight for an idea and in the forefront stands a fundamental principle: Men do not exist for the Federation, the Federation exists for men. First and far above all else stands the idea of the people: the Federation is a form of organisation of this people, and the meaning and the purpose of the Federation are through this form of organisation to assure the life of the people. And from this there arises a new mode of thought and thus necessarily a new political method.

We say: a new mode of thought. Today our whole official political outlook is rooted in the view that the Federation must be maintained because the Federation in itself is the essential thing; we, on the other hand, maintain that the Federation in its form has a definite purpose to fulfill and the moment that it fails to fulfill its purpose the form stands condemned. Above everything stands the purpose to maintain the nation's life - that is the essential thing and one should not speak of a law for the protection of the Federation but for the protection of the nation: it is of this protection that one must think.... In the place of this rigid formal organisation - the Federation - must be set the living organism - the people. Then all action is given a new untrammelled freedom: all the formal fetters which can today be imposed on men become immoral directly they fail to maintain the people, because that is the highest purpose in life and the aim of all reasonable thought and action.

Saxon Hawke wrote:


Your speeches are full of fine talk, but fine talk and dreams of sunny days cannot undo the past sins of your glorious Federation.

You will excuse me if I don't make my ancestors' mistake of buying into your promises of Utopia.


Your ancestors took the poor hand dealt to them by previous administrations and turned to a life of crime, corrupting the young of Placid with drugs and filth. Others took a rougher hand and came out righteous. Those people who were exiled were clearly of the sort it were better that the Federation should do without.

Col. Hans Nardieu (ret.) Chairman, National Party of the Federated Union of Gallente Prime Office of the Party Headquarters, Villore VII-6 Senate Bureau Station

Urthel Drengist
Doomheim
#24 - 2012-07-20 01:13:46 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
free from anarchy


There is nothing wrong with Anarchy....And if you feel otherwise it would be a pleasure to debate that with you.

Urthel Drengist

C.E.O and Founder of Drengist Intergalactic Liberal Enterprises Ltd. [L.I.D.E.L ] 

Syyl'ara
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2012-07-20 03:34:24 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
Saxon Hawke wrote:
Your speeches are full of fine talk, but fine talk and dreams of sunny days cannot undo the past sins of your glorious Federation.

You will excuse me if I don't make my ancestors' mistake of buying into your promises of Utopia.

Your ancestors took the poor hand dealt to them by previous administrations and turned to a life of crime, corrupting the young of Placid with drugs and filth. Others took a rougher hand and came out righteous. Those people who were exiled were clearly of the sort it were better that the Federation should do without.

I'd like to be surprised at your stunning lack of historical knowledge or outright revisionism, but it's become so commonplace that I can't manage to find it in me.

The Federation imposed exile upon many Intaki dissidents for the horrible crime of expressing an unpopular opinion at a time when the Nationalists were in a strong position of power. Your long-winded, platitude-filled statements about the supremacy of the people within a nation over a specific government or administration lands hollow when you follow it with slanderous vilification of a group of people who were punished for utilizing the free speech rights. You know, the same ones that we keep hearing about that are so central to the claim of Gallente enlightenment and should be secured for all people.

Syyl'ara Infrastructure Security Coordinator Ishukone Prosperity Exchange "Cooperation is the greater path than conflict"

Hans Nardieu
Federal Nationalist Party
#26 - 2012-07-20 04:01:00 UTC
Syyl'ara wrote:

The Federation imposed exile upon many Intaki dissidents for the horrible crime of expressing an unpopular opinion at a time when the Nationalists were in a strong position of power. Your long-winded, platitude-filled statements about the supremacy of the people within a nation over a specific government or administration lands hollow when you follow it with slanderous vilification of a group of people who were punished for utilizing the free speech rights. You know, the same ones that we keep hearing about that are so central to the claim of Gallente enlightenment and should be secured for all people.


My dear lady,

You'll note I had nothing to say about the rightness or wrongness of the Intaki exile, merely that the descendants of said exiles had devolved into villainous slime, clustered around floating spacetrash and peddling chemicals to their free brethren in Placid. You can't seriously disagree with this statement.

People of that sort need the order the Federation provides. Just like the in the fable of the Ring of Gyges, once the consequences are removed, that sort show their true nature, nasty and brutish.

Col. Hans Nardieu (ret.) Chairman, National Party of the Federated Union of Gallente Prime Office of the Party Headquarters, Villore VII-6 Senate Bureau Station

Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#27 - 2012-07-20 05:19:22 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
Others took a rougher hand and came out righteous.


Like us, the Caldari people.

Katrina Oniseki

Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
SE7EN-SINS
#28 - 2012-07-20 05:46:32 UTC
And they were worried I was going to embarass the FCO when I joined...

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Syyl'ara
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2012-07-20 13:30:36 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
My dear lady,

You'll note I had nothing to say about the rightness or wrongness of the Intaki exile, merely that the descendants of said exiles had devolved into villainous slime, clustered around floating spacetrash and peddling chemicals to their free brethren in Placid. You can't seriously disagree with this statement.

People of that sort need the order the Federation provides. Just like the in the fable of the Ring of Gyges, once the consequences are removed, that sort show their true nature, nasty and brutish.

It was the Federation that restricted them from colonizing the planets, so where else do you expect them to live but on stations?

Stations that manage to attract quite a few of the political and business class, I might add. They are hardly "floating spacetrash", this is just more mud-slinging.

There are a great many in those territories who make their living, as best they can, through lawful and modest means. Your mention of criminal behavior is true only in the sense that it is universal. Take any group of people and impose enormous restriction upon their ability to sustain themselves through lawful means and they will turn to whatever means remain. The "order" the Federation provided those people was to subject them to conditions which will inevitably result in the exact situation that we've arrived at. This is also a classic case of retro-active justification and a reversal of the classic sins of the father paradigm with an absurdly dubious "sins of your as-of-yet unborn children."

Apparently people are just supposed to crawl under a rock and die quietly so as to not inconvenience your delicate sensibilities even when they have been denied a basic level of human dignity.

Syyl'ara Infrastructure Security Coordinator Ishukone Prosperity Exchange "Cooperation is the greater path than conflict"

Sakaane Eionell
Intaki Liberation Front
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
#30 - 2012-07-20 16:28:55 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
devolved into villainous slime, clustered around floating spacetrash

I find this a curious comment from someone who purports to champion the Federation's model of society. One of the tenets of your free democracy is supposedly to improve the lives of all sentients the Federation graces (imposes upon) with its presence, yet where Syndicate (or any other group the Federation deems lacking to its so-called superior standards) is concerned, often we see Federal patriots and representatives sneering with contempt for those who choose, or are forced to choose, to follow a path that is different to the Federation's ideal. You want people to accept what you think is the best way of life while simultaneously spitting on them for not having done so, or being unable to do so.

Have you ever thought to question why or how the Federation was able to bar the exiles from colonizing planets and moons even though it had no territorial claim to nor governance over the area? Or is it easier to just blame others and ignore the gross extents the Federation goes to in breaking its covenant with freedom of choice and speech and self-determination in examples like Syndicate? And while crime should be worked against, I do wonder how things might have turned out if the exiles had originally been able to access planetary resources instead of being forced to adapt while still under the Federation's heel from afar.

The Federation's definition of freedom is quite narrow. People are free only if they believe they need 'saving' and the Federation will be that savior. Those of us who would prefer another way are supposed to accept the Federation's proclamation that the way we live is wrong and inferior and subsequently allow the Federation to shove itself down our throats. This is a form of tyranny, even if there are also many other worse kinds plaguing New Eden.

True freedom must be married to respect and a realization that an individual or a group of individuals can reject the Federation's ideals and not be persecuted for doing so.
Jev North
Doomheim
#31 - 2012-07-20 17:16:00 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
People of that sort need the order the Federation provides. Just like the in the fable of the Ring of Gyges, once the consequences are removed, that sort show their true nature, nasty and brutish.

A lovely, very old story, and I'm pleased to be reminded of it. Rot, though. You were wise to hedge yourself against it the way you did; it's one of those stories who tell more about the storyteller than the subject.

Even though our love is cruel; even though our stars are crossed.

Saxon Hawke
Intaki Liberation Front
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
#32 - 2012-07-20 19:34:50 UTC
Hans Nardieu wrote:
You'll note I had nothing to say about the rightness or wrongness of the Intaki exile, merely that the descendants of said exiles had devolved into villainous slime, clustered around floating spacetrash and peddling chemicals to their free brethren in Placid. You can't seriously disagree with this statement.


Col. Nardieu, it never ceases to amaze me how easy it is for defenders of the Federation to ignore the grievous wrongs it has committed while pointing out the shortcomings of others.

For all the good you claim your Federation has done, you seem to have forgotten the horror of the exile. As others have already noted that exile was not for nothing more than having an unpopular minority opinion.

For that they were stripped of land, possession and citizenship; sent to the harsh reality of wild space and told to build a new life for themselves. But were they given freedom? No, they were told that if they dared to settle a planet, if they were so bold as to colonize a moon that there would be even greater retribution laid down upon them.

So, left to carve a life for themselves with both hands tied behind their back, they were left to die in space. But they didn’t die, did they? They fought tooth and claw and not only did they live, but they thrived and built a society for themselves.

Sadly, that society isn’t everything that it could have been. Many of the traditional values of the Intaki have been lost, but that is the price they paid. They did not ask to have this evolution thrust on them, but they accepted it rather that allow themselves to be subjected to a slow execution.

But maybe I’m being unfair to cast stones at the Federation for this great travesty of its own core beliefs. After all, no one alive today was responsible for it. It was a mistake, a lapse in the true and inspired vision of the Federation, one that could never be repeated.

In today’s enlightened age all men and women are equal under the Eagle and none are marginalized. We live in an unprecedented age of prosperity where all share equally in the bounty of the Federation’s greatness and voices of all are heard in the great halls of government.

Except that isn’t true, is it? We Intaki live in an age where the members of the government elected to represent us agreed to CONCORD’s plan for a proxy war that flooded our home systems with privateers and brigands sanctioned to wage war in our skies. And then, when it came time to us to voice our displeasure and to elect new leadership, we were disenfranchised and denied one of the most basic and fundamental rights of any citizen in a democracy.

No, Col. Nardieu, the population of the Syndicate is not perfect. But they are honest about their sins.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#33 - 2012-07-20 20:53:56 UTC
Ms Nardieu, maybe the Syndicate population is not the ones to be blamed for the actions of their shady or criminal leaders like the ex SOE Silphy en Diabel that took over 14 years ago. After all, as pointed above, it is not like most of them have any choice in the matter of their lives.
Hans Nardieu
Federal Nationalist Party
#34 - 2012-07-20 22:29:10 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
Ms Nardieu, maybe the Syndicate population is not the ones to be blamed for the actions of their shady or criminal leaders like the ex SOE Silphy en Diabel that took over 14 years ago. After all, as pointed above, it is not like most of them have any choice in the matter of their lives.


Madame, this is the real fallacy of this tragedy. They do have a choice and they've chosen it. And it is the youth of Placid whom organisations such as the IPI purport to defend that pay the price.

Col. Hans Nardieu (ret.) Chairman, National Party of the Federated Union of Gallente Prime Office of the Party Headquarters, Villore VII-6 Senate Bureau Station

Mammal Tafren
Intaki Liberation Front
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
#35 - 2012-07-20 22:46:16 UTC
Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumoured by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations.

But after observation and analysis, when you find anything that agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.
Bastian Valoron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2012-07-21 23:15:54 UTC
It is a misleading verbal trick to try to dub criminals as exiles. The least the Federation can do to protect travel and free enterprise is to try to limit the damage they are causing to the law-abiding citizens.

Any Intaki from the Syndicate can join their hard-working, conscientious and highly respected cousins living in the Federation just by following the procedures to demonstrate that they can be expected to be constructive and trustworthy members of the society.
Syyl'ara
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2012-07-21 23:53:15 UTC
Bastian Valoron wrote:
It is a misleading verbal trick to try to dub criminals as exiles. The least the Federation can do to protect travel and free enterprise is to try to limit the damage they are causing to the law-abiding citizens.

The Federation has had decades to address security issues along its "western" frontier. Either it has neglected to address the problem, preferring instead to direct resources to the central worlds in what could be described as a positive feedback loop or it has been attempting to improve the situation but has been ineffective to the point of ineptitude.

Bastian Valoron wrote:
Any Intaki from the Syndicate can join their hard-working, conscientious and highly respected cousins living in the Federation just by following the procedures to demonstrate that they can be expected to be constructive and trustworthy members of the society.

I have a number of issues here. First of all living in Syndicate and being hard-working, conscientious and highly respected are not mutually exclusive nor does living in the Federation automatically impart these qualities. Second, you drift off into vague rhetoric with your comment about "procedures and demonstrations of trust" which reads to many Syndicate residents as something like "bend over and capitulate or screw off." Finally, you seem to still not grasp the concept that maybe not everyone cares to live under Federation rule, especially when scornful and conceited judgmentalism from representatives like you seems to be the most frequent interaction they have with it.

Syyl'ara Infrastructure Security Coordinator Ishukone Prosperity Exchange "Cooperation is the greater path than conflict"

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#38 - 2012-07-22 10:10:46 UTC
Bastian Valoron wrote:

Any Intaki from the Syndicate can join their hard-working, conscientious and highly respected cousins living in the Federation just by following the procedures to demonstrate that they can be expected to be constructive and trustworthy members of the society.


- Escaping from the Syndicate grasp. A station docking bays are easier to watch than land and spacelines boundaries. High probability of failure, and death or severe injury.

- Affording the black market cost of the travel, or traveling in a clandestine manner. Uncertainties of underground dealings also mean that there is a certain probability of being racketed and lured into a pirate/slaver trap. It is not uncommon.

- Entering Federation spacelines and passing through customs. High probability of being scanned out and returned to Syndicate.

- Providing identity cards or a federal citizen ID or risking to be exiled again. The Federation has never been the open beacon that everyone thinks it is. To a certain degree only.

- If one fails at this point, returning to the Syndicate can prove hazardous and dangerous.
Diana Kim
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry
Templis CALSF
#39 - 2012-07-22 12:02:09 UTC
Valdezi wrote:

Trust me, she is. She just doesn't know it yet.

What the ?..

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

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