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Is CrimeWatch vaporware?

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Author
Crunchie Attuxors
Always Another Corporate Venture
#1 - 2012-07-15 15:59:00 UTC
I mean, there is no indication that there is anything being done with this.

So is it real? Has it been abandoned?

I really do not feel this should be a priority over other things, but I am just wondering if this can be put there in the vaporware category?
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Medarr
Knight Owl Corporation
#2 - 2012-07-15 16:05:11 UTC
Crimewatch is part of the agro mechanics its currently implemented on the live server... its what flags you GCC for shooting idio... errr innocent miners...
Crunchie Attuxors
Always Another Corporate Venture
#3 - 2012-07-15 16:16:13 UTC
Medarr wrote:
Crimewatch is part of the agro mechanics its currently implemented on the live server... its what flags you GCC for shooting idio... errr innocent miners...


I mean the update and overhaul... sorry for shorthanding...
Eve forums official anthem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pudOFG5X6uA Real men tank hull. Fake women shield-tank Gallente.
Anubis Star
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-07-15 16:26:00 UTC
stream
JusFooling Around
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2012-07-15 18:20:25 UTC
KILL ALL BOTS

MINING, COURIOR, MARKETING

Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
#6 - 2012-07-15 18:28:15 UTC
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
Medarr wrote:
Crimewatch is part of the agro mechanics its currently implemented on the live server... its what flags you GCC for shooting idio... errr innocent miners...

I mean the update and overhaul... sorry for shorthanding...

Probably updates in the CSM minutes that are around the corner?
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#7 - 2012-07-15 18:34:45 UTC
Considering how they hadn't even properly thought of how to make it work properly and not completely break highsec PVP the longer it takes to show up the better.
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#8 - 2012-07-15 19:23:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Antisocial Malkavian
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
I mean, there is no indication that there is anything being done with this.

So is it real? Has it been abandoned?

I really do not feel this should be a priority over other things, but I am just wondering if this can be put there in the vaporware category?


Youd think the gankers would want this... Given its supposed to make it so anyone who wants to (not just the non combat skilled miner in question) can kill you after

Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Considering how they hadn't even properly thought of how to make it work properly and not completely fix highsec PVP by making it risky to do the longer it takes to show up the better.


fixt

Was there ever a dev blog about the Goon exloit thing or are they continuing to sweep that under the rug?

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#9 - 2012-07-15 19:37:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Vimsy Vortis
Because making it so that people who are flagged with aggression can be shot at by everyone in space but will get concorded if they shoot back is totally "fixing" highsec PVP.

That's straight up what was proposed at fanfest in the presentation and even after acknowledging that it was a bad idea in the roundtable that came after it they weren't able a think of a way for the suspect flagging system to allow suspects to shoot back without being concorded.

I don't know about you, but I don't think that mechanics like that showing up on TQ would be a good thing.
Pipa Porto
#10 - 2012-07-15 19:55:14 UTC
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
I mean, there is no indication that there is anything being done with this.

So is it real? Has it been abandoned?

I really do not feel this should be a priority over other things, but I am just wondering if this can be put there in the vaporware category?


Youd think the gankers would want this... Given its supposed to make it so anyone who wants to (not just the non combat skilled miner in question) can kill you after


Umm... that's exactly what GCC means. Anyone who wants to can shoot you for 15 minutes.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

Andoria Thara
Fallen Avatars
#11 - 2012-07-15 20:00:40 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Because making it so that people who are flagged with aggression can be shot at by everyone in space but will get concorded if they shoot back is totally "fixing" highsec PVP.

That's straight up what was proposed at fanfest in the presentation and even after acknowledging that it was a bad idea in the roundtable that came after it they weren't able a think of a way for the suspect flagging system to allow suspects to shoot back without being concorded.

I don't know about you, but I don't think that mechanics like that showing up on TQ would be a good thing.


My understanding was anyone who commited a crime would be flashing red for everyone. So logically, if a person shoots at that red flashy person, once the first shot is fired the criminal can fire back without being concorded.

If that's not how it works, and the criminal gets concorded for fighting back, then I can see why they put it on the back burner.
Andoria Thara
Fallen Avatars
#12 - 2012-07-15 20:02:01 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
I mean, there is no indication that there is anything being done with this.

So is it real? Has it been abandoned?

I really do not feel this should be a priority over other things, but I am just wondering if this can be put there in the vaporware category?


Youd think the gankers would want this... Given its supposed to make it so anyone who wants to (not just the non combat skilled miner in question) can kill you after


Umm... that's exactly what GCC means. Anyone who wants to can shoot you for 15 minutes.


But they only get a GCC for firing on a ship, not for can flipping or stealing loot, which is what was proposed.
Pipa Porto
#13 - 2012-07-15 20:13:00 UTC
Andoria Thara wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
I mean, there is no indication that there is anything being done with this.

So is it real? Has it been abandoned?

I really do not feel this should be a priority over other things, but I am just wondering if this can be put there in the vaporware category?


Youd think the gankers would want this... Given its supposed to make it so anyone who wants to (not just the non combat skilled miner in question) can kill you after


Umm... that's exactly what GCC means. Anyone who wants to can shoot you for 15 minutes.


But they only get a GCC for firing on a ship, not for can flipping or stealing loot, which is what was proposed.


GCC means CONCORDokken. But we'll assume it's some global combat flag instead.

Why would everyone get the right to shoot at a thief? The thief only wronged that one person (and his corp). Right now, the victim and his corp can shoot back. Allowing your friends to shoot at those who wrong you is one of the many benefits of Corp membership.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#14 - 2012-07-15 20:24:23 UTC
What was proposed means that the concept of “GCC” is deprecated and no longer applies — the suggested “felon” status kind of replaces it but also differs from it, so you can't really equate the two.

The problem was always with the “suspect” status — the idea that any lesser crime opens you up to retaliation from any player in the vicinity — and the initially hugely imbalanced effect this would have on the criminal elements. It's not just possible, but very very probable that the whole thing is being delayed until they can figure out how to do that part properly to have a balanced set of engagement rules without reintroducing the massive player-to-player flag fur-ball that they wanted to get away from with CW2.0.
CCP Greyscale
C C P
C C P Alliance
#15 - 2012-07-15 21:10:04 UTC
First part of the rework shipped in Escalation, so no, not vaporware. That stage was all behind-the-scenes (as detailed in the presentation at Fanfest, which is on Youtube somewhere); the next step is to start implementing the redesign.

Also, the current design explicitly allows you to return fire in all cases Smile
Jason Xado
Doomheim
#16 - 2012-07-15 21:20:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Jason Xado
CCP Greyscale wrote:
First part of the rework shipped in Escalation, so no, not vaporware. That stage was all behind-the-scenes (as detailed in the presentation at Fanfest, which is on Youtube somewhere); the next step is to start implementing the redesign.

Also, the current design explicitly allows you to return fire in all cases Smile


Any chance we can get some details?

The original idea of the changes was to eliminate the need for aggression maps and keep everything simple. The only way for that to work would be if the suspect couldn't fire back. Otherwise you would have to keep up with an aggression map.

Details would be welcome :-)

Edit: Well another way to do it without maps would be if the suspect could fire at anyone, which although entertaining, would probobly not be the best way to go :-)
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#17 - 2012-07-15 21:20:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Lin-Young Borovskova
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
I mean, there is no indication that there is anything being done with this.

So is it real? Has it been abandoned?

I really do not feel this should be a priority over other things, but I am just wondering if this can be put there in the vaporware category?



CCP Greyscale just talked about in the live stream and seems they can't change as fast as they wanted because after all those years and many changes the core code would break more stuff than it would fix, so they need to do it the right way by starting to implement everything already existing with new code then they pick up something it doesn't screw up everything else and re implement new changes.

Not sure I understood it all right, probably because he speaks a little fast (!) but looks something like this.

brb

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#18 - 2012-07-15 21:25:11 UTC
The inevitable end result will be that the new system will be more difficult to understand than the old system, even if what is happening serverside is simpler.
CCP Greyscale
C C P
C C P Alliance
#19 - 2012-07-15 21:43:19 UTC
Jason Xado wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
First part of the rework shipped in Escalation, so no, not vaporware. That stage was all behind-the-scenes (as detailed in the presentation at Fanfest, which is on Youtube somewhere); the next step is to start implementing the redesign.

Also, the current design explicitly allows you to return fire in all cases Smile


Any chance we can get some details?

The original idea of the changes was to eliminate the need for aggression maps and keep everything simple. The only way for that to work would be if the suspect couldn't fire back. Otherwise you would have to keep up with an aggression map.

Details would be welcome :-)

Edit: Well another way to do it without maps would be if the suspect could fire at anyone, which although entertaining, would probobly not be the best way to go :-)


We allow one-time mappings but we don't make them transitive, ie if you're a suspect and someone shoots you then you can always fire back, but if that person has a third party repping them, you can't shoot the logi because we don't allow aggression transfer like that (for obvious reasons).
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#20 - 2012-07-15 21:45:34 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
The inevitable end result will be that the new system will be more difficult to understand than the old system, even if what is happening serverside is simpler.



Challenge keeps things interesting and actually can't be worst than what it is. High sec PVP fans say they love pvp, witch seems to be true, but I'd like to see what happens if they start getting flagged and spanked by other players just waiting flags, unlike know they're pretty much safe behind concord exploiting aggression mechanics.

I pretty much like the idea every action brings consequences and the fact no one should be safe, whenever it comes to make choices in high sec it shouldn't be the joke it is with neutral repps/jam/boost, there should be real consequences just like in low sec/null/wh space. Those are not trusting Concord mechanics to get it done the easy way.

brb

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