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Blockade Runner for Highsec, Any tips ? Suicide Ganking ?

Author
Lancezh
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-07-09 10:47:39 UTC
I posted in the Ships / Module forum to get fittings for an occator / viator but i would like to ask you guys regardless of fittings specifically about your tactics to avoid HighSec Gankers.

I got killed yesterday in HighSec (0.5) in an Iteron V... from a sniping Tornado with 1400mm's while jumping manually from gate to gate and it was over very quick, resulting in me losing 50% of my wallet worth in assets :( although i even had intertias fitted so i can align faster, it didnt help i was obviously to stupid to do it right.

However, as i already mentioned in the other thread i'm very unfamiliar with how a suicider operates in HighSec in the first place and how i should counter it. Some people say even a Blockade Runner wont protect me, someone else suggested to contract the stuff so it can't be scanned.

How do you go on about this stuff in HighSec ? Whats the weakness of such gankers ? What can i do ?
Dave Stark
#2 - 2012-07-09 10:52:00 UTC
although the training requirements are a pain; orca.

unscannable cargo hold that drops nothing when suicided with 200k ehp. failing that, if you're looking at a blockade runner then they're a nice option. after you practice a bit you can click warp and cloak [in that order] and be cloaked up before any one can lock you.

if all of the above doesn't sound appealing; courier contracts. sure it takes a bit of time, costs a bit of isk, but other people take the risk and worry and you can sit around doing whatever you want in the mean time. if the person accepting the contract goes pop, you get the collateral and you've only lost a bit of time waiting for them to fail the contract.
Abon
Pandorum Research Incorporated
#3 - 2012-07-09 10:54:13 UTC
A cloaky Transport is what i use for moving high value goods around. Never got ganked with one. For everything else like huge amounts of ore or modules just create a contract with according collateral.
Estel Again
Doomheim
#4 - 2012-07-09 11:04:51 UTC
istabs are the Devil. Help you align faster, also helps the enemy lock you faster. Get nanofibers.
Don't use shield extenders (same problem as above); pick resistance mods instead.
Use your cloak immediately after you've jumped; uncloak just before you hit the next gate (practice a bit to be uncloaked and ready to jump as you hit the gate, but not before).
Don't take the shortest route.
Shameless Avenger
Can Preachers of Kador
#5 - 2012-07-09 11:08:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Shameless Avenger
First... a Viator is a Blockade Runner. But an Occator is not. The ship/fit you are looking for is a Viator Fit.

2nd... People are right in that a Viator alone is not gonna help you. It is the tactics that you can use on a well fitted Viator what will give you an edge.

3rd... What you do is, you align to gate, hit mwd, hit cloak, hit jump. When you do this, you de-cloak to align but cloak right back and warp while cloak, making it very difficult for the enemy to get a target lock.

However... This setup gives you like 3000m3 if I remember correctly. I'm gonna take a guess and assume you were using an iteron fit with a cargo-hold many times bigger. The Viator tactic will make you safeER, but you will make 10 times more trips to move the stuff. When you divide the overall cargo from 30k m3 to 3k m3, sometimes is not profitable to gank you, even if you are flying an iteron.

There are more complex tactics like avoiding heavily travel routes, docking in a few stations along the way and changing ships/pilots. Each anti-ganking tactic adds pain and reduces the isk per hour ratio of whatever it is that you are doing. Like everything in eve, risk vs reward.

"This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"

TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#6 - 2012-07-09 11:08:53 UTC
My alt runs a viator around hisec when I'm moving things. It's damn near impossible to get caught in a blockade runner in hisec when jumping gates (undocks are more risky, but set up insta-undocks on the main systems you use and you're fine)
pussnheels
Viziam
#7 - 2012-07-09 11:10:14 UTC
all of the above and learn how the mwd cloak trick works , you willbe very hard to catch

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire

Lancezh
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-07-09 11:11:24 UTC
So many valuable tips, thank you very very much.
Goremageddon Box
Guerrilla Flotilla
#9 - 2012-07-09 11:12:26 UTC
you need to tank some damage. thats all.

a t3 bc will hurt u
Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
#10 - 2012-07-09 11:12:32 UTC
How much tank is enough to be reasonably defended with a battleship in high sec for smaller high valuable cargo, or is this even an option? Is having dual 1600mm , dual LARs, DC II and some caps for energy on a Navy Dominix good enough to keep you alive while you AB it back to the gate in High Sec?
Lancezh
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2012-07-09 11:15:11 UTC
Celeste Taylor wrote:
How much tank is enough to be reasonably defended with a battleship in high sec for smaller high valuable cargo, or is this even an option? Is having dual 1600mm , dual LARs, DC II and some caps for energy on a Navy Dominix good enough to keep you alive while you AB it back to the gate in High Sec?


Why using an AB at all ? all i do is warp from gate to gate manually. No bubbles in hi sec obviously, or am i getting something wrong ?
Spurty
#12 - 2012-07-09 11:16:27 UTC
Cloak first!!!!!!!

MWD is still available for a second after and blows up your sig by 500%

Viator is fine for medium sized loads

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP

Cebraio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-07-09 11:25:46 UTC
Celeste Taylor wrote:
How much tank is enough to be reasonably defended with a battleship in high sec for smaller high valuable cargo, or is this even an option? Is having dual 1600mm , dual LARs, DC II and some caps for energy on a Navy Dominix good enough to keep you alive while you AB it back to the gate in High Sec?


In case of hauling in a BS (or Occator). I don't use armor repairers. Even though Occator gets a bonus to repair amount, I think it's more useful to have a buffer tank (no activation necessary + no delay). So you fit as much armor plates and resistance plates as possible. Also a DCU II, but that needs activation. AB'ing to the gate is probably too slow to give you any advantage. MWD'ing would work, in case of the BS.
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2012-07-09 11:29:51 UTC
Lancezh wrote:
I posted in the Ships / Module forum to get fittings for an occator / viator but i would like to ask you guys regardless of fittings specifically about your tactics to avoid HighSec Gankers.

I got killed yesterday in HighSec (0.5) in an Iteron V... from a sniping Tornado with 1400mm's while jumping manually from gate to gate and it was over very quick, resulting in me losing 50% of my wallet worth in assets :( although i even had intertias fitted so i can align faster, it didnt help i was obviously to stupid to do it right.

However, as i already mentioned in the other thread i'm very unfamiliar with how a suicider operates in HighSec in the first place and how i should counter it. Some people say even a Blockade Runner wont protect me, someone else suggested to contract the stuff so it can't be scanned.

How do you go on about this stuff in HighSec ? Whats the weakness of such gankers ? What can i do ?


go for mods/rigs enhancing your inertia (time you need to get into warp depends on it) rather than cargo extension.

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP

Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#15 - 2012-07-09 11:30:56 UTC
Viator is paper thin. The 5% armor rep bonus is a joke since you'll never get to use the repper. So forget tanking it.

Arrow Kick all cargo expanders and rigs out of it. Just forget using them at all.

Arrow Go for maximum warp velocity (rig), and maxed out agility (1 rig rest low mods).

Slap a target break mod on it in a mid slot tough if you need that you're already in big trouble.

Arrow Have evasive maneuvering, transport ship and navigation skills at 5.
Additionally add an agility implant to your head.

Don't fly afk and you should be nigh impossible to catch. Though you can always have bad luck, like getting decloaked by concord Ugh or have a really bad bump..
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#16 - 2012-07-09 11:31:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
The thing about blockade runners is that if you have to rely on their tank, you've already largely failed.

Its first line of defence is its cloak — they can't target you for attacks or scans if you're not on the overview, and that should only happen for a split second. The second line of defence is the inherent agility (which can be further enhanced) — if they try to get you decloaked, you are no longer there, and if something keeps the cloak from working, you're out of there ASAP.

The tank is to protect against the (veeeeeery) occasional smartbomb camp you might land in, which is also why you might want to uncloak manually at the end of each warp — so you can turn any hardeners on. But even without any kind of tank active, a BR should be able to survive four full volleys of smart bombs (which will require multiple ships to deliver). The same tank should also be enough to keep you safe from an alpha volley or so (and afer the first one, you should be long gone), but again, if it has come to that, something has already gone horribly horribly wrong…

…of course, you can tank the crap out of them — a Crane will quite happily put up some 50k EHP, but as others have pointed out, this will come at the cost of that second line of defence. Either you're easier to lock and hit (sig bloat from a shield tank) or you're slower to get into warp (mass bloat from armour tank), so it's up to you to determine whether it'll be worth it.
pussnheels
Viziam
#17 - 2012-07-09 11:32:15 UTC
Celeste Taylor wrote:
How much tank is enough to be reasonably defended with a battleship in high sec for smaller high valuable cargo, or is this even an option? Is having dual 1600mm , dual LARs, DC II and some caps for energy on a Navy Dominix good enough to keep you alive while you AB it back to the gate in High Sec?

no tank is ever enough if a dedicated group of gankers is out there to get haulers nothing is enough only thing you can hope for is that you are not the easiest target

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire

Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#18 - 2012-07-09 11:38:01 UTC
Celeste Taylor wrote:
How much tank is enough to be reasonably defended with a battleship in high sec for smaller high valuable cargo, or is this even an option? Is having dual 1600mm , dual LARs, DC II and some caps for energy on a Navy Dominix good enough to keep you alive while you AB it back to the gate in High Sec?


Lose the armour-reppers for 2 EANM IIs, you want buffer + resists to survive an alpha-gank. Those reppers will never cycle fast enough to save you.

Your lows (standard Domi = 6 lo slots, IIRC?) should be:

DCU II
2x 1600mm plates
2x EANM II
1x Explosive energised plating

Mids:

Put an MWD in

Hi:

Improved Cloaking Device II

If that buffer isn't enough, then well, you would have died regardless, probably.

Carry your "normal" fit for PvE or whatever plus cargo in your hold till you get where you're going, and refit there.

And, learn the Cloak/MWD maneouvre.

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.

HalfArse
Wixo Trading Co.
#19 - 2012-07-09 12:27:38 UTC
I used to use cloaky haulers in high sec thinking I was untouchable.....then one day I landed on jita 4-4....only i landed just outside of docking range and in the very small space of time it took to get into range and be pulled in I was Alpha'd by some sniper......lost about a bill and learned a very important lesson.

Since then I ahve used nothing but the tanky haulers and they have saved my cargo on a number of occations....for high value low volume cargo (roughly 6k m3) you can fill all the low slots with tank mods (im gallente :D) and you still get a 2+ warp strength. Even sacraficing some low slots for expanders you can have an ok tank.

The tank is more than enough to keep you alive while you align and warp, or if they do get 3+ points on you the tank is enough to survive longer than they do against concord or slow boat back to the gate or wait for friends to arrive.....course if they have 3+ points AND your at war AND bump you off gate AND you have no friends then you are (eventually) screwed.
Estel Again
Doomheim
#20 - 2012-07-09 12:30:15 UTC
HalfArse wrote:
.then one day I landed on jita 4-4....only i landed just outside of docking range and in the very small space of time it took to get into range and be pulled in I was Alpha'd by some sniper......lost about a bill and learned a very important lesson.

The lesson being of course to use a bookmark ~300 km above/below the station instead of warping directly to the station.
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