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International Court of Justice : Oracle vs UsedSoft

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Iron Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-07-08 14:46:19 UTC
"An author of software cannot oppose the resale of his ‘used’ licences allowing the use of his programs downloaded from the internet
The exclusive right of distribution of a copy of a computer program covered by such a licence is exhausted on its first sale"

http://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/docs/application/pdf/2012-07/cp120094en.pdf

How will this change your policy about account selling/char selling?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#2 - 2012-07-08 14:48:01 UTC
It will not change their policy in the slightest because it doesn't affect the licensing EVE uses.

Also, welcome to last week, when we had roughly eighty billion duplicate threads on the optic.
Ottersmacker
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
#3 - 2012-07-08 14:48:19 UTC
Iron Civire wrote:
International Court of Justice

Iron Civire wrote:
http://curia.europa.eu

not sure if srs

i just locked an open door.. strange, yet symbolically compelling.
Grey Azorria
Federation Industries
#4 - 2012-07-08 14:51:57 UTC
Iron Civire wrote:
"An author of software cannot oppose the resale of his ‘used’ licences allowing the use of his programs downloaded from the internet
The exclusive right of distribution of a copy of a computer program covered by such a licence is exhausted on its first sale"

http://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/docs/application/pdf/2012-07/cp120094en.pdf

How will this change your policy about account selling/char selling?

It won't. It's in the EULA, CCP own all chars and accounts, you're just renting them with you subs (or something like that).


Though you could sell your client if you really wanted to...

Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Sometimes when I post, I look at my sig and wish that I'd follow my own god damned advice.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#5 - 2012-07-08 14:56:36 UTC
Ottersmacker wrote:
not sure if srs
To be fair, a lot of people confuse the ICC, ICJ, ECJ, and (depending on language) ECHR.
Kindred Wolf
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-07-08 15:37:32 UTC
But your not paying CCP for a license, your paying them for access to their servers.
Emiko P'eng
#7 - 2012-07-08 15:57:20 UTC
To save repeating it all again!

Here is a link to my previous post on the previous discussion on this subject:

EVE Online Forum - Selling characters (account) for real money

It all boils down to.

Under this ruling

You will own the client software on your PC whether you downloaded or shop bought it. You can sell it on if you wish

You rent an account, therefore you only have the rights CCP allow you.
Y'nit Gidrine
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-07-08 16:24:10 UTC
Grey Azorria wrote:
Iron Civire wrote:
"An author of software cannot oppose the resale of his ‘used’ licences allowing the use of his programs downloaded from the internet
The exclusive right of distribution of a copy of a computer program covered by such a licence is exhausted on its first sale"

http://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/docs/application/pdf/2012-07/cp120094en.pdf

How will this change your policy about account selling/char selling?

It won't. It's in the EULA, CCP own all chars and accounts, you're just renting them with you subs (or something like that).


Though you could sell your client if you really wanted to...


Technically, you are simply giving your money to CCP, and they have no obligations to provide you with any goods or services what-so-ever. Although I somehow doubt that the courts would look very favorably upon CCP if they actually tried to abuse that.
The Protato
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-07-08 23:22:40 UTC
Grey Azorria wrote:
It won't. It's in the EULA, CCP own all chars and accounts, you're just renting them with you subs (or something like that).


Though you could sell your client if you really wanted to...


This EU law says "F*** you" to EULAs. Essentially, it declares them null and void. However, it doesn't apply here, because accounts are not software licences.
Lykouleon
Noble Sentiments
Second Empire.
#10 - 2012-07-08 23:47:24 UTC
Good thing Iceland has yet to have their accession to the EU approved...so basically anything passed by the EU courts can be given the middle finger by Icelandic companies.

Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER so I can hit them with my sword
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-07-09 01:09:02 UTC
Not another one of these threads...

When will people realise that game accounts aren't covered by this because they aren't software licences?

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#12 - 2012-07-09 02:49:45 UTC
The Protato wrote:
Grey Azorria wrote:
It won't. It's in the EULA, CCP own all chars and accounts, you're just renting them with you subs (or something like that).


Though you could sell your client if you really wanted to...


This EU law says "F*** you" to EULAs. Essentially, it declares them null and void. However, it doesn't apply here, because accounts are not software licences.

No, it only declares the specific part null and void. Unless the EULA has a provision where if one part in voided, it all is voided, the rest of it is still valid (as much as it was before).
ShipToaster
#13 - 2012-07-09 03:08:07 UTC
Lykouleon wrote:
Good thing Iceland has yet to have their accession to the EU approved...so basically anything passed by the EU courts can be given the middle finger by Icelandic companies.


Maybe, maybe not.

If Iceland or EFTA or EEA are mentioned in the judgement then you should consider it applicable until advised otherwise by petitioning the court. In practice it looks like Iceland has agreed by treaties to follow EU directives and laws relating to unified markets which would include this.

Internet link for those who believe wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Free_Trade_Association

Application of EU law in Iceland: partial.
EU law enforceable in local courts: unclear.

.
Rajan Marelona
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2012-07-09 03:12:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Rajan Marelona
Iron Civire wrote:
How will this change your policy about account selling/char selling?

Read ruling more careful. It is only about software with unlimited useage time after the purchase. Says so clearly.

Quote:
Where the copyright holder makes available to his customer a copy – tangible or intangible
– and at the same time concludes, in return form payment of a fee, a licence agreement
granting the customer the right to use that copy for an unlimited period, that rightholder
sells the copy to the customer and thus exhausts his exclusive distribution right. Such a
transaction involves a transfer of the right of ownership of the copy.

Things that need continued payment are not to be applied the ruling.
It is possible to be only applied to Germany and not all of EU.

You are not buying the EVE game forever. You are renting access to server for limited time. Nothing changes for EVE, WoW and any other subscription games.
The only games that CAN be affected are games like the Guild Wars 1 where if you bought a copy of the game means permanent server access for you for whatever expansion content you have bought.
It CAN also affect Steam and other services like that. They could be forced to let some people to transfer or sell games they have bought there on to other peoples accounts.
Gorinia Sanford
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2012-07-09 03:30:16 UTC
Iron Civire wrote:
"An author of software cannot oppose the resale of his ‘used’ licences allowing the use of his programs downloaded from the internet
The exclusive right of distribution of a copy of a computer program covered by such a licence is exhausted on its first sale"

http://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/docs/application/pdf/2012-07/cp120094en.pdf

How will this change your policy about account selling/char selling?


Hmmm, an international court of justice? Sounds like mutually exclusive terms "international court" and "justice". Or at the very least, an oxymoron.
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#16 - 2012-07-09 04:09:54 UTC
Moving this from General Discussion to Out of Pod Experience.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department
Blane Xero
The Firestorm Cartel
#17 - 2012-07-09 06:00:48 UTC
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode wrote:
Moving this from General Discussion to Out of Pod Experience.

Lock it. It's a duplicate. Or Triplicate, either way.

Resident Haruhiist since December 2008.

Laying claim to Out of Pod Experience since 2007, plain and simple. Keep the trash out of [u]Out Of Pod Experience[/u], If it's EVE Related or deserves a Lock, it does not belong here.
Shameless Avenger
Can Preachers of Kador
#18 - 2012-07-09 07:23:03 UTC
The EVE client is free, you never bought the client not a license for it.

"This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
Cierejai
Biofuel Productions
#19 - 2012-07-10 12:47:48 UTC
Emiko P'eng wrote:
To save repeating it all again!

Here is a link to my previous post on the previous discussion on this subject:

EVE Online Forum - Selling characters (account) for real money

It all boils down to.

Under this ruling

You will own the client software on your PC whether you downloaded or shop bought it. You can sell it on if you wish

You rent an account, therefore you only have the rights CCP allow you.


So I can sell my client that anyone with an internet connection can download for free from CCP?

Cool story bro.