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Crimes for Unposted Policies?

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Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#101 - 2012-06-13 01:59:20 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
I don't really care for any special privileges or protection granted to new players simply because giving them the illusion that they are immune in hisec will simply come back to bite them when they get suicide ganked while mining in a Hulk or traveling in a shiny T3. I could see why prohibiting can baiting in starter systems is disallowed, but epic arc systems are quite the stretch.
No one got told off for can baiting in epic arc systems.

Someone got a warning or w/e for deliberately targetting brand new players who were running the epic arc.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#102 - 2012-06-13 02:00:19 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
However, your complete inability to understand a very simple concept is causing my brain to overload. How is it you fail to understand that the rules regarding rookies are not just to cover them in the starter systems, but to cover them until they pass that magic 1 month mark?
Because the rule doesn't just cover newbies. It's a blanket ban on aggression games in a very specific set of systems. Newbies or not is utterly irrelevant, and that's why the rule you keep quoting is irrelevant as well. The question is whether or not that list of systems has been increased.

Quote:
That is the rule for ROOKIE SYSTEMS.
Yes. That's the whole point. It is now apparently not only being applied to rookie systems. How can you be so dense as to not get it. It has only been explained for five pages. And let's do it again, just for good measure:

Tyberius Franklin wrote:
I'm lost, what is everyone actually discussing at this point.
It's quite simple.

The rule is: there is a complete ban of can flipping, can baiting, and similar aggression games in a very small set of systems — the starter systems where the tutorial agents are housed and the systems where the career agents are housed. Newbie or not doesn't matter — you're flat out not allowed to do it regardless of who the target is.

The question is: has this list of systems been expanded to include the (high-traffic, very normal) SOE-arc systems, giving them the same blanket restrictions as the old systems?
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#103 - 2012-06-13 02:00:39 UTC
Adriel Malakai wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:

Dear god another person who does not understand. That is the rule for ROOKIE SYSTEMS. It is not the ONLY rule designed to cover rookies. Seriously, how can people be so thick?


What you do NOT understand is that the warning/ban the OP was discussing mentioned that the epic arc systems WERE NOW CONSIDERED ROOKIE SYSTEMS. What people want to know is whether or not CCPs definition of rookie systems has been expanded. Have you even read the OP?



Learn to read. What the OP wants to know is if he got warned/banned because he was screwing with a rookie and breaking one of the rules covering rookies OR if the reason for his warning/ban is covered under the rookie system rule.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#104 - 2012-06-13 02:01:56 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
However, your complete inability to understand a very simple concept is causing my brain to overload. How is it you fail to understand that the rules regarding rookies are not just to cover them in the starter systems, but to cover them until they pass that magic 1 month mark?
Because the rule doesn't just cover newbies. It's a blanket ban on aggression games in a very specific set of systems. Newbies or not is utterly irrelevant, and that's why the rule you keep quoting is irrelevant as well. The question is whether or not that list of systems has been increased.

Quote:
That is the rule for ROOKIE SYSTEMS.
Yes. That's the whole point. It is now apparently not only being applied to rookie systems. How can you be so dense as to not get it. It has only been explained for five pages. And let's do it again, just for good measure:

Tyberius Franklin wrote:
I'm lost, what is everyone actually discussing at this point.
It's quite simple.

The rule is: there is a complete ban of can flipping, can baiting, and similar aggression games in a very small set of systems — the starter systems where the tutorial agents are housed and the systems where the career agents are housed. Newbie or not doesn't matter — you're flat out not allowed to do it regardless of who the target is.

The question is: has this list of systems been expanded to include the (high-traffic, very normal) SOE-arc systems, giving them the same blanket restrictions as the old systems?

The answer: No.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Evil Stare
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#105 - 2012-06-13 02:03:02 UTC
Zedrich Ederech wrote:
Not just can baiting - we have either pirates or griefers ninjalooting quest items -....
50 shades of WOW.
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#106 - 2012-06-13 02:03:03 UTC
Tippia wrote:


The question is: has this list of systems been expanded to include the (high-traffic, very normal) SOE-arc systems, giving them the same blanket restrictions as the old systems?


The OP did NOT say that he was warned/banned because the systems where the SOE systems are now covered by the rookie system rules, he just wants to know if that IS the case. What he AND you seem to have utterly missed is that there are OTHER rules in place to keep rookies safe from basement dwelling nubtards, and that THIS is why he got what was coming to him.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#107 - 2012-06-13 02:03:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Adriel Malakai
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Way to be dense for not reading 90% of this thread, or the part of my quoted post where i mention SOE missions, which do not take place ONLY in rookie systems.

-10/10 for literacy issues.


I swear, you must have downs.

The rules explicitly state that activities such as can-baiting and flipping are only considered griefing in rookie systems.

They then explicitly list rookie systems.

Now, warnings are being given stating that can-baiting in SOE epic arc systems is griefing, but there has never been any posts, blogs, nor announcements indicating that these systems have switched to being considered rookie systems.

All the OP wants, is a confirmation whether or not these systems are now actually considered rookie systems. If they are, the GMs need to explicitly list every single system that is considered a rookie system, since you are not allowed to do any non-war related pvp in those systems.

If these systems are not considered rookie systems, then this needs to be clarified, the warning/ban removed, and the GM staff informed of this.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#108 - 2012-06-13 02:03:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Simi Kusoni wrote:
The answer: No.
Incorrect. The answer is: we don't know; could the GMs please clarify.

Cutter Isaacson wrote:
The OP did NOT say that he was warned/banned because the systems where the SOE systems are now covered by the rookie system rules, he just wants to know if that IS the case.
Now you're getting it.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#109 - 2012-06-13 02:05:59 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:

The OP did NOT say that he was warned/banned because the systems where the SOE systems are now covered by the rookie system rules

That is in fact exactly what the OP meant. He just failed to get that across because he's an inarticulate moron.
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#110 - 2012-06-13 02:07:16 UTC
Adriel Malakai wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Way to be dense for not reading 90% of this thread, or the part of my quoted post where i mention SOE missions, which do not take place ONLY in rookie systems.

-10/10 for literacy issues.


I swear, you must have downs.

The rules explicitly state that activities such as can-baiting and flipping are only considered griefing in rookie systems.

They then explicitly list rookie systems.

Now, warnings are being given stating that can-baiting in SOE epic arc systems is griefing, but there has never been any posts, blogs, nor announcements indicating that these systems have switched to being considered rookie systems.

All the OP wants, is a confirmation whether or not these systems are now actually considered rookie systems. If they are, the GMs need to explicitly list every single system that is considered a rookie system, since you are not allowed to do any non-war related pvp in those systems.

If these systems are not considered rookie systems, then this needs to be clarified, the warning/ban removed, and the GM staff informed of this.



Ok, for you, Tippia and any other people suffering severe literacy problems I shall make it clear.



THIS GUY GOT HIS BAN/WARNING FOR SCREWING WITH ROOKIES. THERE ARE OTHER RULES IN PLACE TO PROTECT THEM OTHER THAN THE ONES COVERING ROOKIE SYSTEMS. THESE RULES ARE LEFT VAGUE FOR THE PURPOSE STATED BY HOMONIA, THAT BEING TO STOP THE WANKERS FROM DOING WHAT THEY ALWAYS DO AND FINDING AND ABUSING THE LOOPHOLES.

There, I hope you can see that clearly enough.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#111 - 2012-06-13 02:08:50 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Ok, for you, Tippia and any other people suffering severe literacy problems I shall make it clear.

THIS GUY GOT HIS BAN/WARNING FOR SCREWING WITH ROOKIES.
…except we don't know that. So you can make your version as clear as you like. It doesn't alter or answer the question.
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#112 - 2012-06-13 02:09:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Cutter Isaacson
Tippia wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:
The answer: No.
Incorrect. The answer is: we don't know; could the GMs please clarify.

Cutter Isaacson wrote:
The OP did NOT say that he was warned/banned because the systems where the SOE systems are now covered by the rookie system rules, he just wants to know if that IS the case.
Now you're getting it.



Don't cherry pick my posts Tippia, it only serves to make you look inarticulate and incapable of holding up your end of a discussion.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#113 - 2012-06-13 02:11:32 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Ok, for you, Tippia and any other people suffering severe literacy problems I shall make it clear.

THIS GUY GOT HIS BAN/WARNING FOR SCREWING WITH ROOKIES.
…except we don't know that. So you can make your version as clear as you like. It doesn't alter or answer the question.



The answer to your question as well as the OP's

GM Homonoia wrote:
Some rules are vague on purpose and they will remain vague. This is the 'reckless driving' equivalent. If I define the rules to the last dot someone will simply find a loop hole and use it. The rule is "do not mess with rookies", and if you are in doubt the answer is ALWAYS 'do not do it'.

Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master


Posting in the vain hope one of you learns to read sometime soon.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#114 - 2012-06-13 02:12:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Don't cherry pick my posts Tippia
Then don't cherry-pick the rules being asked about and the questions being asked. Also, don't make up your own facts.

You can keep posting that quote. It is as irrelevant as the first time you posted it because it doesn't address the question in the slightest.
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#115 - 2012-06-13 02:12:28 UTC
I just want to know whether or not CCP is officialy calling the SOE Epic Arc Systems rookie systems. The warnings/bans I originally spoke of specifically mentioned that they were for griefing in a rookie system, and that the event took place in Arnon. Specifically, the warnings were issued for griefing non-rookies in the epic arc systems, not for killing 2 week-old rookies.

Hunting week old characters is not worth anyone's time, and is not the point of the post. The problem is that the rookie system rule prevents me from killing the several month old dumbass flying a vindicator. CCP needs to clarify if these systems are now protected by the 'rookie-griefing' blanket ruling that prevents all non-war based pvp in those systems.

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#116 - 2012-06-13 02:12:29 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Ok, for you, Tippia and any other people suffering severe literacy problems I shall make it clear.

THIS GUY GOT HIS BAN/WARNING FOR SCREWING WITH ROOKIES.
…except we don't know that. So you can make your version as clear as you like. It doesn't alter or answer the question.

Tbf, if you check OPs killboard its pretty obvious he got his warning for screwing with rookies.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
isk4trade
Cogitation Mining and Industrial Trading
#117 - 2012-06-13 02:14:16 UTC  |  Edited by: isk4trade
Ok ... I posted a LONG, considered and I think intelligent reply to this thread and it seems to have disappeared into limbo.

BEAUTIFUL

You people are missing a LOT of issues here.


1. What is a "rookie"?
2. What is a "rookie" system?
3 What is NOT permitted in a rookie system and to WHOM? (players below a certain game age or everyone?)
4. What if a very young player is the alt of a veteran player working at getting aggression for his alt? Is he still a "rookie"?
5. Do you not know that MANY veteran players come through Arnon to do the Epic Arc missions to tweak their faction standings? I have seen lots and lots of 2003 to 2011 players doing the Epic Arc in Arnon doing just that in very Elite ships.
6. How does one comply with "cease such activities or face repercussions" orders if they don't know what activities are meant really?
7. Do you not realize there is often much wailing and gnashing of teeth about "can flipping" and "griefing" and "ganking" when all that has occurred at the time is a simple THEFT?
8. Do you know how many systems are involved with the SOE Epic Arc all the way to Metropolis and surrounds and back?

I was also recently given a GM warning telling me to cease posting offensive links on local or face "repercussions". and not given the link or what type of content was in it. I therefore do not know what is and is not acceptible to post in the way of a link so must I stop posting all but acceptible to kindergarten students links? This may seem a little OT but it is very related to the issues at hand.

I found the notice terse, vague, and generic - leaving me not knowing even summarily what I should NOT do in the future to avoid @repercussions".

These types of warnings reminds me of kids that used to set themselves up as ChannelMasters or Moderators on BBS's served over the Commodore 64 many many many years ago where what WAS and WAS NOT permitted was dependent upon who was online and what mood they were in, and is not appropriate policing for a PAY TO PLAY commercial game IMO.

me
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#118 - 2012-06-13 02:14:18 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
Don't cherry pick my posts Tippia
Then don't cherry-pick the rules being asked about and the questions being asked. Also, don't make up your own facts.

You can keep posting that quote. It is as irrelevant as the first time you posted it because it doesn't address the question in the slightest.



Just to repeat myself, yet again, I am making nothing up.

GM Homonoia wrote:
Some rules are vague on purpose and they will remain vague. This is the 'reckless driving' equivalent. If I define the rules to the last dot someone will simply find a loop hole and use it. The rule is "do not mess with rookies", and if you are in doubt the answer is ALWAYS 'do not do it'.

Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master


Pretty sure my name is not GM Homonoia

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#119 - 2012-06-13 02:15:08 UTC
Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
I just want to know whether or not CCP is officialy calling the SOE Epic Arc Systems rookie systems. The warnings/bans I originally spoke of specifically mentioned that they were for griefing in a rookie system, and that the event took place in Arnon. Specifically, the warnings were issued for griefing non-rookies in the epic arc systems, not for killing 2 week-old rookies.

Hunting week old characters is not worth anyone's time, and is not the point of the post. The problem is that the rookie system rule prevents me from killing the several month old dumbass flying a vindicator. CCP needs to clarify if these systems are now protected by the 'rookie-griefing' blanket ruling that prevents all non-war based pvp in those systems.


Cutter - read this post and hopefully you'll finally pull your head out and realize that you've been arguing a non-issue this entire thread.

Like I said in nearly every post, the question is whether or not the epic-arc systems are now classified as rookie systems, making all forms of pvp that are not war related illegal - even against non-rookies.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#120 - 2012-06-13 02:15:38 UTC
Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
I just want to know whether or not CCP is officialy calling the SOE Epic Arc Systems rookie systems. The warnings/bans I originally spoke of specifically mentioned that they were for griefing in a rookie system, and that the event took place in Arnon. Specifically, the warnings were issued for griefing non-rookies in the epic arc systems, not for killing 2 week-old rookies.

Hunting week old characters is not worth anyone's time, and is not the point of the post. The problem is that the rookie system rule prevents me from killing the several month old dumbass flying a vindicator. CCP needs to clarify if these systems are now protected by the 'rookie-griefing' blanket ruling that prevents all non-war based pvp in those systems.

*I stand corrected.

Although tbf, you have killed a lot of noob ships in arnon.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]