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Explosive Damage = Kinetic Damage + Thermal Damage ?
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Kaname Hagiri
Doomheim
#1 - 2011-10-04 07:38:56 UTC
Well , I know they are just names, srtings, and I know it's not important whatever they are. Just a casual talk.

This thought came to me now and then that something like A / B / A+B is not the most elegant way of naming categories.

If there is water magic and cold magic in a game, there shouldn't also be ice magic. They may just change it to fire or light or whatever.

What Sci-fi idea do you like if you can replace the damage type 'explosive' in eve?

I like 'antimatter damage' .
Maybe acid damage of ZergBig smile?
non judgement
Without Fear
Flying Burning Ships Alliance
#2 - 2011-10-04 07:42:20 UTC  |  Edited by: non judgement
Isn't it more like nuclear explosion?

see the projectile ammo descriptions and the ones that do mostly explosive damage. Aren't they nuclear?
Kehro Urgus
Dark Nebula Academy
O X I D E
#3 - 2011-10-04 07:44:11 UTC
I've sometimes wondrered how you could have explosive (percussive) damage in a vacuum.What?

Yeeee! 
Fix Lag
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2011-10-04 07:57:09 UTC
oh god arguing physics in a sci-fi game

CCP mostly sucks at their job, but Veritas is a pretty cool dude.
Digital Messiah
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-10-04 07:58:00 UTC
Kehro Urgus wrote:
I've sometimes wondrered how you could have explosive (percussive) damage in a vacuum.What?
The force from the shock wave, and yes, I think they are supposed to be nuclear.

Something clever
Dradius Calvantia
Lip Shords
#6 - 2011-10-04 08:03:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Dradius Calvantia
Facepalm....

Leave the arm chair science to us real armchair scientists.
Karim alRashid
Starboard.
#7 - 2011-10-04 08:08:53 UTC
Kehro Urgus wrote:
I've sometimes wondrered how you could have explosive (percussive) damage in a vacuum.What?


EVE space is not vacuum. Blink

Pain is weakness leaving the body http://www.youtube.com/user/AlRashidKarim/videos
Kehro Urgus
Dark Nebula Academy
O X I D E
#8 - 2011-10-04 08:09:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Kehro Urgus
Digital Messiah wrote:
Kehro Urgus wrote:
I've sometimes wondrered how you could have explosive (percussive) damage in a vacuum.What?
The force from the shock wave, and yes, I think they are supposed to be nuclear.



Which would be thermal and em.Ugh

Yeeee! 
Ur235
Appetite 4 Destruction
#9 - 2011-10-04 08:10:05 UTC
Its a game who cares if it doesnt follow the rules of physics or not jeesus just play the damn thing

hmm
Thgil Goldcore
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2011-10-04 08:12:15 UTC
Explosive is very different than kenetic or thermal damage.

Consider the difference between a small object propelled to high speeds could give out the same amount of energy as a large explosive object. How you would prepare defenses for one would be completely different than the other.

Although... big note... thermonuclear warheads don't really work in space. The damage from a nuclear weapon is more about the pressure wave and the heat flash. The heat flash is negligible compared to being in close proximity to a sun, and the pressure wave has no atmosphere to carry it.... but again real science to sci-fi is silly.

As far as a good weapon in EVE lore, why not a weapon which puts a cloud around an opposing ship at atmospheric temperatures and pressures. Tritanium, according to lore, is highly explosive under these conditions... so the armor of the ship would go pop.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#11 - 2011-10-04 08:57:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Rodj Blake
Digital Messiah wrote:
Kehro Urgus wrote:
I've sometimes wondrered how you could have explosive (percussive) damage in a vacuum.What?
The force from the shock wave, and yes, I think they are supposed to be nuclear.

You can't have a shockwave in a vacuum.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#12 - 2011-10-04 09:02:24 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
A shockwave needs a medium to pass through.
And it has such a medium: the ship.

Spalling is nasty.
Jita Alt666
#13 - 2011-10-04 09:04:10 UTC
Ugh people. It is a game. There are so many flaws in the physics of this game that I cringe everytime I undock. (which is never)
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#14 - 2011-10-04 09:04:26 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Digital Messiah wrote:
Kehro Urgus wrote:
I've sometimes wondrered how you could have explosive (percussive) damage in a vacuum.What?
The force from the shock wave, and yes, I think they are supposed to be nuclear.

You can't have a shockwave in a vacuum.

There the armor as a medium and I guess shields act in a similar way.

I think kinetic damage is directed kinetic force, while explosive is undirected kinetic force.

Piercing vs Ripping
Point vs Blunt
Slugs vs Shot

Something like that.

Sovereignty and Population

New Mining Mechanics
baltec1
Bat Country
The Initiative.
#15 - 2011-10-04 09:06:44 UTC
I know how to make stuff like ice explode so you can rule out thermalBlink
Deopheel Dalonne
Eridu Productions
#16 - 2011-10-04 09:20:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Deopheel Dalonne
This is how we could "physically" explain thermal, Kinetic and EMP:

Thermal = increase in temperature caused by light (IR or laser).
Kinetic = actual atoms hitting you.
EMP = electromagnetic field (i.e. light again) causing the electrons in your ship to go in circles.

In order to remain consistent with that, we may say that "explosive" is a neutron wave that causes the atomic nuclei in your ship to explode and undergo a nuclear reaction. That would correspond to the connection with "nuclear" warheads in projectile ammo and missile.
Dirk Magnum
Spearhead Endeavors
#17 - 2011-10-04 10:38:29 UTC
The area between the ship and its shields is not a vacuum. If the shields are down, the explosion and blast wave occur inside the structure of the ship, or between the structure and armor coating, which is also not in a vacuum. So there.

Also, thermal damage is the direct application of enormous temperature. You don't need an explosion for that (ergo distinct from 'explosive' damage.) In the real world, IIRC, heat built up by an object in a vacuum has a hard time bleeding off, so if you wanted to damage something in space by applying a heat source directly to it, you could. Of course, if we assume again that the ship itself is not technically IN a vacuum anyway then it doesn't matter.

Kinetic damage is just hitting something until it dies. In reality if you wanted to hurt something in space, this is by far the easiest way to do it, since there's no atmosphere to slow down the projectile.

Now let me get back to my submarine spaceboat oh wait it's downtime.

                      "LIVE FAST DIE." - traditional Minmatar ethos [citation needed]
Sebastian N Cain
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2011-10-04 11:01:45 UTC
Jita Alt666 wrote:
Ugh people. It is a game. There are so many flaws in the physics of this game that I cringe everytime I undock. (which is never)


Frankly speaking it´s better that way. Even something as simple as flying from a to b within the same system would be an annoying ***** if you had to do this with realistic physics.
I can´t be arsed to have to calculate my turning point (where i switch from acceleration to deceleration) every time i want to fly in space and have to take care to execute that maneuver with an accuracy of a fraction of a second.
In fact, if you want to do something more complex flying than this, you would absolutely need a full computer controlled ship, because as in RL a human can´t really do this on his own. At which point all of us would simply watch bots flying in space.

I got lost in thought... it was unfamiliar territory.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#19 - 2011-10-04 11:23:10 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
You can't have a shockwave in a vacuum.


A ball of burning gas expanding outwards under its own pressure is not a vacuum, and it does indeed form a shockwave.

I'm not sure why so many people insist that you can't have explosions in space. The only technical difficulty is taking your oxidiser with you since there's no atmosphere. The great advantage of explosions in space is that there is no atmosphere to mess up your beautiful explosions. Spaceship hulls don't have a surrounding fluid to help damp the shockwave travelling through the hull either. Heck, they don't have surrounding fluid to damp the noise of the air conditioners.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Gealbhan
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2011-10-04 11:30:49 UTC
Imagine if CCP went all out in obeying the laws of physics in =v=...

There would be tears, many free floating tears.
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