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Dreads. What is going to be done with them?
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Renan Ruivo
Forcas armadas
Brave Collective
#1 - 2011-10-03 01:16:04 UTC
I have read all available CSM minutes since its been elected and i have some ideas about what is going to happen with dreads on the winter expansion.

But i'm curious to know about what other people know and/or suspect is going to be changed in them (For instance i know soundwave has dropped a suggestion about decreasing its siege time and increasing EHP). And what you think should be done with them as well.

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David Grogan
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2011-10-03 01:17:10 UTC
siege timer reduced to 5mins

moar dps & ehp while in siege mode

thats about it

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Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#3 - 2011-10-03 01:44:57 UTC
no mining bonus for ice?

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David Grogan
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2011-10-03 01:48:33 UTC
Bienator II wrote:
no mining bonus for ice?



nope but they should mine veldspar better

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Renan Ruivo
Forcas armadas
Brave Collective
#5 - 2011-10-03 02:05:30 UTC
David Grogan wrote:
Bienator II wrote:
no mining bonus for ice?



nope but they should mine veldspar better


Well now siege green would be a proper tactic for doing that.

The world is a community of idiots doing a series of things until it explodes and we all die.
ACE McFACE
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2011-10-03 04:39:15 UTC
Im not sure what they are doing but they should make it so Carriers can't speed tank them

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Mechael
Tribal Liberation Distribution and Retail
#7 - 2011-10-03 05:21:24 UTC
Dreads should be an anti capship/structure platform. Outside of seige mode, they should be able to take out carriers with comparative ease (more tracking/DPS.) In seige mode, they should make shooting at structures not be such a mind-numbing experience (more DPS, less tracking.) They should have a lot of trouble hitting battleships or smaller.

I'm in favor of making seige mode primarily designed around structure shooting. You know ... seiges. Not battles in the "field." That said, I'm actually in favor of longer seige mod cycles and **** poor tracking in exchange for vastly improved DPS. A few dreads should be able to eat through a large POS in no time, at the risk of being stuck there for a little while after the work is done (meaning blobbing dreads up in one location and entering seige mode would be overkill and result in a vulnerable dread fleet.)

Just, please, make sure that while OUTSIDE of seige mode they can pop carriers.

TL;DR: Seige mode should make short work of structures. Outside of seige mode is when it's time to bash other caps.

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Solhild
Doomheim
#8 - 2011-10-03 05:27:39 UTC
erm...allow hisec gate use?
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Midgard Academy
#9 - 2011-10-03 05:53:47 UTC
siege timer needs to be much much faster 5 mins is nice. 2.5 mins would be super win!

but siege mode shoudl give 25% to shield and armor and hull resists.

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Sadayiel
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2011-10-03 06:43:19 UTC
make siege modules to be able to load scripts

Pos script increase the dread dmg ehp and gives a % res reduction on his target.

The Cap script increases his tracking andfighter defense thus allowing them to take carriers and mom easily, therefore dreads are now a siege platform or a cap killer while the subcaps like Bs are still a good counter to them
Renan Ruivo
Forcas armadas
Brave Collective
#11 - 2011-10-03 06:57:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Renan Ruivo
I think that a fleet which has 40 to 50 supercarriers should be dead scared of a fleet that has 25 to 40 dreads. It IS as simple as that.

25 to 40 dreads hold no danger to a subcap fleet of, say, 200 battleships so they would be of little use against anything other than a super carrier blob. In that situation, however, it would make mince supercarrier metal.


The magic lies in discouraging alliances from fielding supercarrier blobs because if they get known for using such tactic, their enemies would prepare accordingly and they would suffer a massive ISK loss. However, if your alliance brings in the odd gang (i said gang.. 5 to 10) supercarriers to a battle they would be much more effective because the enemy wouldn't be expecting them and would not have prepared their dreadnougths accordingly.


Alliances should strive to make their enemies think that no super carrier would be used, instead of taking pride in being super carrier hoarders they are today. Because lets be real... nobody brings dreadnoughts to their everyday engagements...



TL;DR

Supercarriers have little counter, dreadnoughts have little use. The course of action is obvious.

Dread and Scarrier 1 on 1? Dread wins. Every ******* time. Should be like that.

The world is a community of idiots doing a series of things until it explodes and we all die.
mkint
#12 - 2011-10-03 09:05:45 UTC
The thoughts in this thread are scary when taken in context of the thoughts in the original supercarrier threads from way back. You all just want to turn dreads into the new supers. Dreads used to be relevant until supers usurped their role... remove supers' ability to do the dreads' role (shooting at structures), and dreads will come back without the need for much buffing at all. The supers killer needs to be a subcap, ideally one that can be hotdropped without a bridge (i.e. a buffed black ops) and is relatively impervious to capital weapons (maybe a velocity buff and sig radius buff.)

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Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
#13 - 2011-10-03 09:39:40 UTC
Renan Ruivo wrote:
I think that a fleet which has 40 to 50 supercarriers should be dead scared of a fleet that has 25 to 40 dreads. It IS as simple as that.

TL;DR

Dread and Scarrier 1 on 1? Dread wins. Every ******* time. Should be like that.


Tech 2 dreads that eat super caps for breakfast? Maybe some new type of turret/launcher thrown in for good measure.

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Jack bubu
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#14 - 2011-10-03 09:45:57 UTC
Renan Ruivo wrote:
I think that a fleet which has 40 to 50 supercarriers should be dead scared of a fleet that has 25 to 40 dreads. It IS as simple as that.

25 to 40 dreads hold no danger to a subcap fleet of, say, 200 battleships so they would be of little use against anything other than a super carrier blob. In that situation, however, it would make mince supercarrier metal.


The magic lies in discouraging alliances from fielding supercarrier blobs because if they get known for using such tactic, their enemies would prepare accordingly and they would suffer a massive ISK loss. However, if your alliance brings in the odd gang (i said gang.. 5 to 10) supercarriers to a battle they would be much more effective because the enemy wouldn't be expecting them and would not have prepared their dreadnougths accordingly.


Alliances should strive to make their enemies think that no super carrier would be used, instead of taking pride in being super carrier hoarders they are today. Because lets be real... nobody brings dreadnoughts to their everyday engagements...



TL;DR

Supercarriers have little counter, dreadnoughts have little use. The course of action is obvious.

Dread and Scarrier 1 on 1? Dread wins. Every ******* time. Should be like that.


Sure if you rise the production costs of dreads to about 20 bil.

Scrubs and their scrub ships.. pffsh
Caius Sivaris
Dark Nexxus
#15 - 2011-10-03 09:49:01 UTC
Permit them to be remote repaired when sieged and that makes them worth fielding again.

Being unable to move and the reduced tracking and target locked is enough of a nerf for sieging already.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#16 - 2011-10-03 09:53:44 UTC
Halve the seige cycle timer and stront use.

Maybe have seigeing give some kind of unstacked resist bonus to increase EHP and rep a bit (Seige mode doubling the shield/armour resist bonus from Damage Control Systems, and adding +10% to the hull resist bonus, would do the job nicely) to take into accout the changed conditions on the battlefield, by which I mean fighter-bombers.

Otherwise, dreads are OK in and of themselves.

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Karim alRashid
Starboard.
#17 - 2011-10-03 10:31:07 UTC
Malcanis wrote:

Otherwise, dreads are OK in and of themselves.


Perhaps Phoenix needs some love, sieged Phoenix can't touch anything that moves, this is drastically different from Moros and Revelation (no idea for the bublegum one).

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Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#18 - 2011-10-03 10:46:26 UTC
Dunno, would +400% damage against supercaps and sov structures and outposts when in siege mode help?

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Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#19 - 2011-10-03 11:17:00 UTC
Just drop the super carries HP's considerably and / or make slaves and other armour increasing items to affect only subcapital class ships.
I'd have no issues with SC if they wouldn't sport such a ridiculously high DPS while having as much if not more ehp then a small POS, either one has to go.
Maxwell Thomas
APEX Unlimited
APEX Conglomerate
#20 - 2011-10-04 02:41:12 UTC
I like the idea of being able to be remote repped. i would add a resist bonus when sieged.
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