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Fixing Suicide Ganking
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ClimClomClue
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-05-12 21:27:32 UTC
Suicide Ganking has two main unavoidable consequences.

#1 The suicide ganking ship has to be destroyed.
#2 The security status of the Suicide Ganker has to drop.

They fixed #1 a few weeks ago. Now Gankers can't run away from CONCORD.

The second point hasn't yet been fixed. Instead of punishing the recycling of characters, CCP should extend the security hit of this kind of criminal acts to the other characters of the account if not to any other account and character linked to the ganker.
Xorv
Questionable Acquisitions
#2 - 2012-05-12 21:39:38 UTC
Prolific Suicide Ganking is the symptom of excessive artificial restraints on PvP and Piracy in an area of high wealth generation. Either move the farms and fields from High Sec or nerf crimewatch and CONCORD and watch suicide ganking disappear into the history books of EVE.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3 - 2012-05-12 21:47:40 UTC
ClimClomClue wrote:
CCP should extend the security hit of this kind of criminal acts to the other characters of the account if not to any other account and character linked to the ganker.



Why? What purpose would this serve?
Mag's
Azn Empire
#4 - 2012-05-12 22:29:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Mag's
1. If you didn't know, it's been a ban-able offense to avoid concord since I can remember. The use of an exploit is irrelevant, as an argument for changes to suicide ganking.

2. Why? Recycling alts is also a ban-able offense. But as you bring it up, you must therefore believe it plays large a part in this. What evidence do you have to back this up?

Last but not least, why does it need fixing at all? CCP provide you with the tools to avoid it. Why does your lack of use of these tools, mean any change is needed?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
ugh zug
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-05-12 22:58:24 UTC
the system is fine as is.

Want me to shut up? Remove content from my post,1B. Remove my content from a thread I have started 2B.
ClimClomClue
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-05-12 23:08:07 UTC  |  Edited by: ClimClomClue
Both avoiding and recycling are a banable offense. Nevertheless they took the time to fix CONCORD avoidance and I think that they should fix Alt recylcing too.

I also disagree with the excess of wealth generation in Hisec theory. Null and lowsec are way more profitable.There are more people who chose to stay in Hisec not because the wealth generation but because of the safety. I'm not saying that they should completly remove Suicide ganking. I'm just saying that they need to impose real penalties to the suicide gankers.

After a few kills, suicide gankers should be shown flashy red in local no matter what character or account they're using.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2012-05-12 23:29:51 UTC
ClimClomClue wrote:

After a few kills, suicide gankers should be shown flashy red in local no matter what character or account they're using.


But why? What does my alt have to do with my sec status? RP wise they're different people entirely.

If I have a -10 and a +5 on the same account, why punish the latter? And how, exactly, would you apply the actions of a character on one account to a character on another account entirely? I'm -6 on this character, your proposal would stop me from rolling up an anti-pirate roleplaying alt on a different account entirely, for no apparent reason. Explain to me why this is a good thing.
Xorv
Questionable Acquisitions
#8 - 2012-05-12 23:53:55 UTC
ClimClomClue wrote:

I also disagree with the excess of wealth generation in Hisec theory. Null and lowsec are way more profitable.There are more people who chose to stay in Hisec not because the wealth generation but because of the safety.


No, that safety makes it much easier to generate the wealth, it's still about wealth generation.

ClimClomClue wrote:

After a few kills, suicide gankers should be shown flashy red in local no matter what character or account they're using.


The issues of using alts to avoid consequences is far more reaching than just suicide gankers. What about players that use alts to PvE or transport high value goods in NPC corps to avoid Wardecs? It's the ability to do such things that push players towards suicide ganking in the first place. I'm not against curtailing the use of alts and other means of players avoiding consequences, but it should be applied universally, not to just a single side of a particular issue.
Im Super Gay
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2012-05-13 00:03:56 UTC
You don't need to recycle alts to suicide gank, faction police is to slow to prevent -10 pilots from warping around in hisec anyway.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2012-05-13 00:12:17 UTC
ClimClomClue wrote:
Suicide Ganking has two main unavoidable consequences.

#1 The suicide ganking ship has to be destroyed.
#2 The security status of the Suicide Ganker has to drop.

They fixed #1 a few weeks ago. Now Gankers can't run away from CONCORD.

The second point hasn't yet been fixed. Instead of punishing the recycling of characters, CCP should extend the security hit of this kind of criminal acts to the other characters of the account if not to any other account and character linked to the ganker.



I don't think so; unless they also extend all the training I do to each character on the account simultainiously to all alts on the account.. The point of alts is they are completely separate..

and even if they did extend the sec hit.. what would stop them from using two accounts to get around this?

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Mag's
Azn Empire
#11 - 2012-05-13 01:43:14 UTC
ClimClomClue wrote:
Both avoiding and recycling are a banable offense. Nevertheless they took the time to fix CONCORD avoidance and I think that they should fix Alt recylcing too.
It was an exploit that was fixed. It's not relevant when suggesting changes to suicide ganking and neither is alt recycling. But I'll ask again, where is your evidence regarding alt recycling?

ClimClomClue wrote:
I also disagree with the excess of wealth generation in Hisec theory. Null and lowsec are way more profitable.There are more people who chose to stay in Hisec not because the wealth generation but because of the safety. I'm not saying that they should completly remove Suicide ganking. I'm just saying that they need to impose real penalties to the suicide gankers.
There are already real penalties for the suicide ganker. Sec status and monetary penalties. Just as there are penalties to the gankee, for not using the right tools for the job, or going AFK whilst doing it.

ClimClomClue wrote:
After a few kills, suicide gankers should be shown flashy red in local no matter what character or account they're using.
So you want a sanctioned in game activity, to start giving a meta game penalty because you either don't like it, or can't play the game right?

Apart from trying and failing to use exploits as a reason for change, you've yet to establish any need at all.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.