Test Server Feedback

I am trying mate, hoping against hope that some dev says "thank you for the feedback and ideas and we will look into it, some of the stuff you mention makes sense ", but as usual they force some unfinished half product that aside eye-candy works worse than the old one.

I was gonna make TQ inventory and Sisi comparison with pictures, but then i remember how much we argued about CQ and were ignored (till Jita riots), how much people complained about new font and were ignored. New textures are still low-res, ships look like crap from upclose, but at least they are 16 shades darker....Caldari are almost black, Amarr went from golden to turd colored textures. Its like no one in CCP gives a damn about feedback, i am wondering if they plan to make minmatar ships pink and call it art.

Still, as you said, Tippia is still trying. My hats of to her.

Hey all, I'd just like to say, that our intention is not to ignore you, your feedback or indeed appear condescending. The feedback you are providing us is proving really, really valuable and we are working to resolve the issues you guys raise.

Some of the points being brought up are extremely valid, but we cannot implement them at the tip of the hat. Someone mentioned that we appear to be ignoring the feedback, we are not and we are already acting on it internally.

So to summarize, thank you for taking the time to write your replies, come to the forums, file bug reports, go to the test servers and show us this system is a close to live environment.

Our intention is to improve the user experience not hamper it.

Also kudos to Tippia who is making the most compelling arguments on the behalf of many of you. We are just human and are just looking for a conversation with the players (we want it!). But the old system is not coming back, but with your help we can make this new system what you guys need it to be.

Ok, a little more conciliatory tone there. Many thanks.

I've also had a decent nights sleep and feeling uncharacteristically in a good mood. It won't last I hope. Feels odd.

I've spoken with the CSM and they have assured me that you guys usually have internal builds that are many leaps ahead of what is on Sisi and I shouldn't judge whats on it as final product. I accept that is a fact of design. You keep chipping away until you find a solution.

I like the filters idea. I'm unlikely to use it because I'm a boxes guy. I like things in boxes. But I can see why it would help people.

The 'tree' I hate with a heat that rivals the Sun. I've always hated branch navigation in GUI's since the invention of GUI's back in the days of using an Amiga 500. Likely before most at CCP were even born. I've never used them in Windows and never on Mac OS9 and OSX. The option as always been turned off and will forever remain turned of until I die. So the chance's of your ever convincing me to use it in a game are none. Icons and windows. It's what I've used in computing for nearly three decades. They work better, faster and more efficiently than any interface that has ever been produced and no amount of argument will change my mind because I've 30 years of personal experience to back me up.

As to wanting the old system back. I don't want it back. There are many varied reasons why you've done what done. Most would be background optimization of code that keeps the memory footprint of the game low and reduce client and server strain. Those are good enough reasons alone to redo the inventory system.

What I'm asking for, nay, begging for, is for the new system to be able to as closely as possible replicate the visual look, feel and workflow patterns of the old one, should an old fart like me wish to set it up as such. And from the feedback from just this thread alone tell's I am by far not the only one to feel that way.

Until it can do that I strongly advise you to keep it off TQ until its ready. Most Eve players don't use Sisi, They rely on the dev blogs and forums posts to find out whats coming up. And if their forced to use it and its not changed from its current form you WILL have a lot of upset paying customers.

Or in the words of certain CCP employee "we watch what you do, not what you say".
So far, actions speed louder than words.

Just do it. Cargo is the most important to PvP after fitting, and also hugely important to people moving things to market/POS, looting in PvE, etc. Set the shortcut by default.
Same as ALT being a terrible default for look-at, what with many dual-boxing and hitting alt+tab and also causing a terrible camera change & disorientation until it's unbound as a shortcut.

Double-clicking is easy to accidentally do (especially in pressured or laggy environments, think need to get something combat ready & undocked asap). Boarding a ship off of this is bad for 2 reasons. Firstly it could just do the previous default action of opening the cargo to make the change to this UI more seamless. Secondly it's make a server-side change, the player is now in a different ship without perhaps meaning to be, and their other inventory options get changed because of this.
Boarding a ship always has been easy enough by right-clicking and boarding (IDK why people like to drag to station scene).

Also, I've not checked if this has been raised, but resizing the inventory window needs to not scale all the contained UI. I chiefly use large icon view, and once the left index area is set wide enough to view the labels, I have the right hand side pane large enough to show complete item rows & columns at a time. When I'm resizing the inventory UI I'm wanting to add or remove row & columns-worth of area at a time for max usability. Currently the index pane divisor will move with resizing. I can't just make the UI 1 column wider and see 1 more column, instead I get most of a column but nothing's wrapped in to use that space, and a larger index label area which is useless. Divisor needs to stay at absolute position to the left side within this UI.

I believe people have already made the obvious cases for an in-space minimalist & remembered UI layout for muscle-memory assisted use of cargo & cans (think magic-bag can-in-cargo use with cap boosters for active tankers), while needing a different, larger rembered layout for docked/inside FF interactions with the completely different use-case sections such as ships hanger and station/pos containers.

This new system seems like one of the very common programming/engineering mistakes: development in a vacuum with no defined/invoked standards.

It's great that you are asking for feedback, but that fact you created something so far away from sensible means that you spent a lot of time building something in a vacuum devoid of user input. The fact that there are so many inconsistencies means you failed to define and then invoke standards of usage.

My PvP friends consider me to be a slow keyboardist. Your new system only exacerbates my slowness....

Go back to the drawing board, and this time, use the feedback, and define and invoke standards so that everything functions consistently. You have earned a thumbs down from me.

Lastly, this seems like a veiled attempt to make it more difficult for macroers and botters. If so, this is yet another failed form of engineering, in that it makes life more difficult for the human users for the sake of deterring macroers/botters.

Please stop posting, your ~angry words~ are not helping. Also, if you are attempting to troll, all you are doing is screwing up a decent UI change. So, go away.


RubberBAND, you are doing a decent job so far, and thank your for trying to improve the UI

I mostly like the single window, its seamless and intuitive while in station. It is less so while in space, where the "multiple boxes" work much better.

Personally I am ok with the tree setup, though it needs to be more clearly organized. Having my active ship above everything else was quite odd.

Also, Please don't remove the "Ships" and "Items" buttons, they are very useful, and accessing one of those inventories directly, rather than 2-3 clicks is beneficial, especially in a PvP situation where shortcuts might be forgotten. Remember we have many many shortcuts to try and remember.

Lastly, opening up multiple boxes with Shift-click works, but things like double-click or right-click would also be beneficial. Please remember keyboard strokes may not always be optimal.

Far too quirky and complicated. Imagine if a cell phone company tried to sell this windowing system as "new and improved" ... They would be bankrupt. And it reminds me a of statement people made about the UI when I started this game: "You'll get used to it." This new system seems like more of the same garbage UI design that is NOT user friendly and easy to use. It is NOT new and improved. It is less intuitive and more cumbersome.

CCP :: start over.

I think I can get used to most of the inventory system. There are only three (maybe it counts as more?) changes I would like. I would like to be able to see the active ship in the inventory. As is, I would never use the CQ because I would have to go over to the sofa or out the the balcony to see which ship I'm in. Mind you, if I have another ship in the station, I could switch out and back in to figure out which one I was in, but that is a bit cumbersome. Please tell me if I'm not correct in my assumption that I can't view my active ship in the new system.

Another change I would like to see is more delineation in the levels of inventory, as the current text is not indented enough to make the levels clear. I would also like to see, specifically, the "corp items" in the orca at the same level as the other "Ore Hold", "Ship Maintenance Bay", etc. and would also like to see the Orca cargohold in that same listing, as opposed to requiring a right-click on the orca name.

I think I can get used to the rest, although finding the inventory button has so far been a bit of a pain. A solution to this would be to allow moving the character sheet button to below the inventory button to separate it from the other buttons. I did move the inventory button to right under the character sheet.

So like it or tough seems to be the general message from CCP. Nice

Thanks

Tal