Player Features and Ideas Discussion

since I have and use one for transports, a nerf is a nonononono for me , if that would mean I could loose a 7b ship + cargo to some cyno camper junkies.

Yeah I don't really think nerfing them by putting them at risk when they cyno in would be the right way to go anyway, it would just make moving them around annoying and it's too easily circumvented by only cynoing into blue/empty systems.

I do however feel that moving 300,000m3+ around should have some kind of logistical challenge/risk involved.

what if I say jumpbridges were nerfed down to the level where JF already are?
Just because CCP nerfed one thing does not strictly mean everything else needs nerfing as well. Its a simple but flawed logic, we would never exit this loop anymore.

Try to keep in mind what effect they create in game, before you condemn them as detrimental.

They cannot fight, they do not try to fight, and they move less than their non jumping versions.

What they do add, however, is the logistics to place more fighting ships into pilot hangars. They help prevent blockades by jumping over them.
(A blockaded system being slowly sieged is boring, as they make an effort to NOT use fighting ships they cannot replace because of the blockade)

I believe CCP's implied position is that more fights happen when the fighting ships reach the fighting pilots, rather than burning up inside a non jumping freighter.

Prolonged conflict is good. Rapidly resolved fights equals peace. Peace = Z z Z z Z z Z z....

Jump Freighters should be nerfed, as should all jump and bridge mechanics. Mainly by increasing the price a few orders of magnitude.

They should all be used solely in cases of major strategic importance of corporate or even alliance level, never for personal convenience or simply 'making easy money'. Make it so expensive no member can afford frequent use for their own petty personal reasons.

Many people thought the rogue drones dropping minerals were driving miners in empire out of a job, but they completely forget that this was only made possible because jumpfreighters and bridged freighters allowed safe and easy mass-transport of these minerals in the first place. Using jump-mechanics should never be abused as a way to make risk-free and effortless money.

The same goes for excessive blobbing, KM-whoring hotdrops in low-sec and alliances being able to NAP their entire side of the map and then curbstomping smaller alliances on the other side of the galaxy as a weekend trip.

Hey guess what....JF are fine. Like OP says, they are massively expensive and require two accounts to act in concert. CCP wants you to spend extra money for convience, because the pissy players refuse to buy gold ammo. Also, its your duty to cripple those logistic chains as a JF is ment to avoid the enemy (by bypassing those gate camps, unless you really enjoy those kinds of things)which means you go find them and if you can't / won't....then its your fault and you are stuck dealing with the problems that occur after the ship reaches the destination.

And how is a JF avoiding risk? Its not...its putting expensive amounts of cargo to travel from null through low to highsec and back. Its also the tool to get people into null...guess what if you hit that one smal normall freighter convoy that is boring as hell and suddenly they loose billions...they won't go back to nullsec. Really, big losses are discouraging but you do want people in nullsec do you want? So why push them away when you want them there in the first place.

But hell, if everyone wants risk I keep suggesting that you lose skillpoints when your ship goes pop. Why stay so focused on a JF or moving level 4s to lowsec....just go full out and lose it all. Trust me, even you will not like risk that costs you time you cannot get back .

From what I've seen, I don't think that JFs are specifically bad for the game. I agree with Nikk Narrel that they help promote good fights and cut down on some of the boredom. Putting gate camps aside, hauling things out in a freighter would still be risky and end up getting killed at times. JFs help minimize the situation where you have a group saying "Well, I guess I'm just going to log off for the night because we couldn't get any ships here to fight in", which isn't really fun for anyone.

Yes, they are a powerful tool, but they are also extremely expensive to all but the richest of entities and they're certainly not invincible, there are 13 JF KMss on Eve-Kill this month so far and 40 last month. They cut down on the boredom, stress, and danger of one of the more important and under-appreciated roles in an alliance and help fights happen by getting ships and supplies to the people who need them.

To be honest if you have any sov space at all, then you probably have the numbers to escort a transport ship occasionally.

It might make life a little more difficult, but then Eve is supposed to be a challenge. And having some real logistics going on might even give those little alliances roaming gangs, or pirates of whatever type, something real to shoot at. Instead of them just picking off the odd idiot who stumbles into them.


Well to be honest I'm kind of against force projection being easy anyway, at the moment the situation you and Nikk are using is the typical one of a large alliance cynoing a load of ships to the other side of Eve and rolling all over a few random smaller alliances for the lolz.

In my view long distance attacks of this sort should take considerable effort, and the defender should always have an advantage for being at home. Sub capitals should be moved into position by the attacker before hand, and if you start running out of ships before the job is done, or faster than you can replace them, then you failed and you should go home.


I don't really think they are particularly expensive, especially not for what they do. Their price makes them expensive, but not unrealistically so for a solo pilot to buy. And the number that die is relatively low for how common they are.


Well if they are used primarily to move ships and supplies, why not make the cargo bay considerably smaller, and give them a ship hangar in it's place?

The reality is they are not use primarily to transport ships, combat or otherwise. They are used primarily to transport minerals, moon mats and NPC loot/salvage etc.

Personally I would like to see them changed into something with a similar high capacity, that cannot jump. And just make it insanely good at getting round instead. Like a giant, nullified, cloak capable transport ship with (moderately) good align time for it's size. At least then it would still be reasonably safe, but would still require scouting and some coordination/effort.

Anything would be better IMHO than something that can teleport across Eve in a few minutes.

Nerf jump freighters, increase mineral prices. Voila, more expensive rifters.

To be honest this I why I'd rather see JF's role changed, rather than an outright nerf.

I'd prefer to see a giant, expensive, nullified T2 transport than something that can literally traverse Eve in moments with little effort. Hell, give it an inbuilt covert ops cloak and warp core bonus for all I care. It'd be damn hard to catch, you could move it quickly with a fast fleet for protection and the only way to catch it would be to warp in between the ship and the scout, decloak and get enough points on it to kill it.

It'd still be better than teleporting. The current system just makes Eve smaller, kills local markets and aids power projection. I honestly can't see a single upside other than cheaper minerals and life in Eve being made easier, neither of which are necessarily upsides.