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Players of high sec - CCP is trolling you and laughing while doing it. A proposition.
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Shian Yang
#501 - 2012-05-07 02:18:47 UTC
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
So...it's up to you. You the pilots, traders, industrialist, miners and salvagers of high sec to take a stand if you wish to see high sec become less of the killing grounds that they are. Bring balance back to this region of space by petitioning CCP to stop trolling you and to provide the game of EVE that is fair to all who play it and not just a chosen few.


Greetings capsuleer,

The Council of Stellar Management exists to take issues to CCP. Under their charter you can promote a topic in Jita Park Speakers Corner and, if you get sufficient support, will force them to discuss and potentially take this to CCP. You will however need to ensure the message gets out to sufficient players; which will mean getting your arse out of that capsule and communicating.

So there are avenues to use, no matter how misguided I think you are being and how wrong your understanding of New Eden is.

I look forward to reading your post in Jita Park Speakers Corner and seeing the level of support it garners.

Regards,

Shian Yang
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#502 - 2012-05-07 09:57:45 UTC
Andski wrote:
look at the tanks on these hulks:

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13290711
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13290644
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13290593
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13290528
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13290328

I did not pick these out selectively. Those are the last five Hulk losses on eve-kill - if you're dumb enough to believe in some "ISK tank" nonsense you can rightly get lost.


Clearly the best tank for a Hulk

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#503 - 2012-05-07 10:59:07 UTC
This thread has proven (to me, most probably old news to many others) that hisec miners who whine about gankers:

1) have absolutely no ******* clue how to fit their expensive ship

2) are completely reluctant to even discuss ship fitting, even when good fits are posted for their benefit. Props to Andski and Malcanis.

Only one who reacted didn't understand fitting implants or damage types.

I'm losing my hope for mankind.

.
Lady Vamp
Perkone
Caldari State
#504 - 2012-05-07 11:20:49 UTC
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
How ironic is it that CCP talks about risk-vs-reward yet allows players to skill up throw away alts, that can easily get into one of the cheapest ships in the game, where upon they can fly in high sec and blow up a ship 300 times the value of the ship they are flying?

Price a catalyst.
Price a hulk.

People in low and null sec scream that there is a huge imbalance in regions and that high sec players don't take the kind of risk people in low sec and null sec take.

Bulldung...complete and utter bulldung.

People in high sec are at just as much risk, if not more, than people in null sec and low sec. There is zero risk involved when a player can easily skill up an alt to fly a destroyer that only cost around 2 mil to buy and arm it. So tell me people of null and low sec with your camped gates and well protected play areas - how is where you play any different than the people that play in high sec?

Anyone that has played the snooze fest that is 0.0 knows that this risk - vs - reward is total BS. If anything the average pilots that do fly hulks and orcas in high sec take bigger risk than anyone playing in null sec. Especially when a person can so easily get into a cheap ship and blow the crap out of them any time they please.

CCP allows this - calls it game play when in actuality it is them laughing at you for thinking you are safe. People in high sec are the least safe people playing EVE. Yes it is griefing...it is griefing because it is so easily done. CCP doesn't care. The people that use the tactic do not care.

They are trolling you and all you do is - go get another tube of lube and say - "please sir...may I have some more."

If you want this to stop it is up to us high sec players to unite. Demand justice! Demand that this form of griefing be stopped. Unite under one flag and declare war on CCP. Stop being a victim. Start being assertive! Demand your rights as a player that CCP fix this unabashed exploit and bring some sense of fair game play to an area of space that is suppose to be the lesser of three evils. As it is now that is not the case - high sec is the most dangerous place for players to play EVE.

So...it's up to you. You the pilots, traders, industrialist, miners and salvagers of high sec to take a stand if you wish to see high sec become less of the killing grounds that they are. Bring balance back to this region of space by petitioning CCP to stop trolling you and to provide the game of EVE that is fair to all who play it and not just a chosen few.


Maybe there should be some sort of fine like when you are caught with illegal drugs Lol
Welsige
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#505 - 2012-05-07 16:02:07 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Kietay Ayari wrote:

Personally I do not care either way, what astounds me is the number of people who are not willing to work for anything and try to use some faulty moral code along with their helplessness to justify their request for others to do things.


Yes, all that lazy people who got a wife, two children, friends, relatives, work 50 hours a week, do 2 hours comnmuting, and won't invest their bloody time in playing EVE like True Manly Men. Roll



What? Get lost....

I got a wife, a mba, a job, work 50 or more ours per week, have parents, lose more hours i transit than I would like and manage to have a social life.

I still manage to invest time in the game, and do a lot of things.

Not sure what the point of your post is.


[b]~ 10.058 ~

Free The Mittani[/b]
Welsige
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#506 - 2012-05-07 16:11:25 UTC
Whitehound wrote:


fighting a mob of zombies with rainbows.




I would buy a game like that.

[b]~ 10.058 ~

Free The Mittani[/b]
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#507 - 2012-05-07 17:25:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
How ironic is it that CCP talks about risk-vs-reward yet allows players to skill up throw away alts, that can easily get into one of the cheapest ships in the game, where upon they can fly in high sec and blow up a ship 300 times the value of the ship they are flying?

Price a catalyst.
Price a hulk.

People in low and null sec scream that there is a huge imbalance in regions and that high sec players don't take the kind of risk people in low sec and null sec take.

Bulldung...complete and utter bulldung.

People in high sec are at just as much risk, if not more, than people in null sec and low sec. There is zero risk involved when a player can easily skill up an alt to fly a destroyer that only cost around 2 mil to buy and arm it. So tell me people of null and low sec with your camped gates and well protected play areas - how is where you play any different than the people that play in high sec?

Anyone that has played the snooze fest that is 0.0 knows that this risk - vs - reward is total BS. If anything the average pilots that do fly hulks and orcas in high sec take bigger risk than anyone playing in null sec. Especially when a person can so easily get into a cheap ship and blow the crap out of them any time they please.

CCP allows this - calls it game play when in actuality it is them laughing at you for thinking you are safe. People in high sec are the least safe people playing EVE. Yes it is griefing...it is griefing because it is so easily done. CCP doesn't care. The people that use the tactic do not care.

They are trolling you and all you do is - go get another tube of lube and say - "please sir...may I have some more."

If you want this to stop it is up to us high sec players to unite. Demand justice! Demand that this form of griefing be stopped. Unite under one flag and declare war on CCP. Stop being a victim. Start being assertive! Demand your rights as a player that CCP fix this unabashed exploit and bring some sense of fair game play to an area of space that is suppose to be the lesser of three evils. As it is now that is not the case - high sec is the most dangerous place for players to play EVE.

So...it's up to you. You the pilots, traders, industrialist, miners and salvagers of high sec to take a stand if you wish to see high sec become less of the killing grounds that they are. Bring balance back to this region of space by petitioning CCP to stop trolling you and to provide the game of EVE that is fair to all who play it and not just a chosen few.



That's some good ranting.

What a shame that CCP Diagoras released that actual numbers a few months ago:

0.0 sees ~twelve times* as many ships lost per capita population as high-sec.

Call me when hi sec gets 13 times as violent as it is now, sweetheart. Until then, shush.



*Twelve is a conservative estimate; the real figure is probably about 14x

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Saia Tae Arragosa
Doomheim
#508 - 2012-05-07 18:16:20 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
How ironic is it that CCP talks about risk-vs-reward yet allows players to skill up throw away alts, that can easily get into one of the cheapest ships in the game, where upon they can fly in high sec and blow up a ship 300 times the value of the ship they are flying?

Price a catalyst.
Price a hulk.

People in low and null sec scream that there is a huge imbalance in regions and that high sec players don't take the kind of risk people in low sec and null sec take.

Bulldung...complete and utter bulldung.

People in high sec are at just as much risk, if not more, than people in null sec and low sec. There is zero risk involved when a player can easily skill up an alt to fly a destroyer that only cost around 2 mil to buy and arm it. So tell me people of null and low sec with your camped gates and well protected play areas - how is where you play any different than the people that play in high sec?

Anyone that has played the snooze fest that is 0.0 knows that this risk - vs - reward is total BS. If anything the average pilots that do fly hulks and orcas in high sec take bigger risk than anyone playing in null sec. Especially when a person can so easily get into a cheap ship and blow the crap out of them any time they please.

CCP allows this - calls it game play when in actuality it is them laughing at you for thinking you are safe. People in high sec are the least safe people playing EVE. Yes it is griefing...it is griefing because it is so easily done. CCP doesn't care. The people that use the tactic do not care.

They are trolling you and all you do is - go get another tube of lube and say - "please sir...may I have some more."

If you want this to stop it is up to us high sec players to unite. Demand justice! Demand that this form of griefing be stopped. Unite under one flag and declare war on CCP. Stop being a victim. Start being assertive! Demand your rights as a player that CCP fix this unabashed exploit and bring some sense of fair game play to an area of space that is suppose to be the lesser of three evils. As it is now that is not the case - high sec is the most dangerous place for players to play EVE.

So...it's up to you. You the pilots, traders, industrialist, miners and salvagers of high sec to take a stand if you wish to see high sec become less of the killing grounds that they are. Bring balance back to this region of space by petitioning CCP to stop trolling you and to provide the game of EVE that is fair to all who play it and not just a chosen few.



That's some good ranting.

What a shame that CCP Diagoras released that actual numbers a few months ago:

0.0 sees ~twelve times* as many ships lost per capita population as high-sec.

Call me when hi sec gets 13 times as violent as it is now, sweetheart. Until then, shush.



*Twelve is a conservative estimate; the real figure is probably about 14x


Malcanis, yes this is true, more ships are destroyed in 0.0 and low sec than in high sec, but it is simply because that is what 0.0 and low sec is all about - war. High sec was suppose to be an alternative to war 24/7.

Anyway, the people of high sec and 0.0 space need to come together and work this out. Find a solution. One that is amiable to all. We know that EVE is driven by the destruction of ships - we can have that - but does it have to be at the cost of new players?
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#509 - 2012-05-07 18:32:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
If high-sec is supposed to be an alternative to 24/7 war, WTF ARE THERE WAR MECHANICS IN-GAME AND WHY IS CCP REVISITING THESE RULES?

The people of null and high-sec come together all the time to work this out. Usually it involves Tornadoes and Thrashers.

If new players can't handle losing ships when they're new (you can't fly a Hulk as a new pilot anyway - claiming otherwise is simpering) they won't be able to handle a loss when they're established due to the onset of hubris.

In short, they want us as little as we want them. The players you so caringly worry about losing were never meant to play this game in the first place.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Saia Tae Arragosa
Doomheim
#510 - 2012-05-07 18:38:51 UTC
Darth Gustav wrote:
If high-sec is supposed to be an alternative to 24/7 war, WTF ARE THERE WAR MECHANICS IN-GAME AND WHY IS CCP REVISITING THESE RULES?

The people of null and high-sec come together all the time to work this out. Usually it involves Tornadoes and Thrashers.

If new players can't handle losing ships when they're new (you can't fly a Hulk as a new pilot anyway - claiming otherwise is simpering) they won't be able to handle a loss when they're established due to the onset of hubris.

In short, they want us as little as we want them. The players you so caringly worry about losing were never meant to play this game in the first place.


Yes, but where is the risk vs reward CCP and 0.0 pilots are always touting? How is it a risk for a player to skill up an alt and use it for one reason, to grief. There is 0 risk involved in that and easily done. The game would work as it was intended if this was balanced properly. At the time it isn't.

And stop trying to make it seem like you and the others are all hardcore. Blah...we're suppose to be playing a game. One we can all enjoy. Wouldn't it be better if we worked out a solution where this is possible?
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#511 - 2012-05-07 18:48:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
Darth Gustav wrote:
If high-sec is supposed to be an alternative to 24/7 war, WTF ARE THERE WAR MECHANICS IN-GAME AND WHY IS CCP REVISITING THESE RULES?

The people of null and high-sec come together all the time to work this out. Usually it involves Tornadoes and Thrashers.

If new players can't handle losing ships when they're new (you can't fly a Hulk as a new pilot anyway - claiming otherwise is simpering) they won't be able to handle a loss when they're established due to the onset of hubris.

In short, they want us as little as we want them. The players you so caringly worry about losing were never meant to play this game in the first place.


Yes, but where is the risk vs reward CCP and 0.0 pilots are always touting? How is it a risk for a player to skill up an alt and use it for one reason, to grief. There is 0 risk involved in that and easily done. The game would work as it was intended if this was balanced properly. At the time it isn't.

And stop trying to make it seem like you and the others are all hardcore. Blah...we're suppose to be playing a game. One we can all enjoy. Wouldn't it be better if we worked out a solution where this is possible?

There is more risk than you know in ganking:

First, there's the chance that the target will run, leaving you with zero fun for your investment. Kind of like getting ganked does for a miner, I would imagine.

Second, there is the risk that you will be identified in local prior to the gank. Many a time have I been made. Again, no fun derived from my investment.

Third, the risk that nothing good will drop. This leaves my investment wanting in the returns area. Much like a miner who arrives at a belt to find all the good ore is gone already.

Fourth, the miner may actually survive. Then my ship is thrown away for nothing. At this point the miner gets a feeling very akin to the one the ganker was seeking: A thrill. This turn of fortunes can be especially problematic, as it removes all of the ganker's derived enjoyment and transfers it to the miner.

The rewards are usually pretty paltry compared to the risks to be honest.

But what I find most telling is how you try to change the subject. You claim Hulkageddon costs CCP the subscriptions of "new players" but you are really just using a euphemism for "miner" - which is not very flattering at all to you or anybody else in the profession. You claim high-sec is supposed to be a place devoid of war, but then you don't answer the tough questions - you just ask more questions - different questions - to hide the fact that you don't have any reasonable argument at all.

I do.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
JitaPriceChecker2
Doomheim
#512 - 2012-05-07 19:12:23 UTC
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
Darth Gustav wrote:
If high-sec is supposed to be an alternative to 24/7 war, WTF ARE THERE WAR MECHANICS IN-GAME AND WHY IS CCP REVISITING THESE RULES?

The people of null and high-sec come together all the time to work this out. Usually it involves Tornadoes and Thrashers.

If new players can't handle losing ships when they're new (you can't fly a Hulk as a new pilot anyway - claiming otherwise is simpering) they won't be able to handle a loss when they're established due to the onset of hubris.

In short, they want us as little as we want them. The players you so caringly worry about losing were never meant to play this game in the first place.


Yes, but where is the risk vs reward CCP and 0.0 pilots are always touting? How is it a risk for a player to skill up an alt and use it for one reason, to grief. There is 0 risk involved in that and easily done. The game would work as it was intended if this was balanced properly. At the time it isn't.

And stop trying to make it seem like you and the others are all hardcore. Blah...we're suppose to be playing a game. One we can all enjoy. Wouldn't it be better if we worked out a solution where this is possible?


I actually agree there should be more risk for suicide gankers, but mechanics of such are ok.
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#513 - 2012-05-09 04:10:08 UTC
Here is a whine thread posted by Saia.

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]
Alxea
Unstable Pirate Sharks Of The Damed Sea
#514 - 2012-05-09 04:14:31 UTC
malaire wrote:
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
...
So...it's up to you. You the pilots, traders, industrialist, miners and salvagers of high sec to take a stand if you wish to see high sec become less of the killing grounds that they are.
...

I am highsec trader and I do not care how dangerous it is to fly here. I do not fly here, I just use courier contracts to outsource the risk of getting ganked.

So for me there is nothing which needs to be fixed. Big smile


We help your ships get traded! Pirate Ships get bought and sold more because we help eve! Twisted
Saia Tae Arragosa
Doomheim
#515 - 2012-05-09 04:19:07 UTC
Lapine Davion wrote:
Here is a whine thread posted by Saia.


Your turnips are boiling.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#516 - 2012-05-09 04:21:00 UTC
Alxea wrote:
malaire wrote:
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
...
So...it's up to you. You the pilots, traders, industrialist, miners and salvagers of high sec to take a stand if you wish to see high sec become less of the killing grounds that they are.
...

I am highsec trader and I do not care how dangerous it is to fly here. I do not fly here, I just use courier contracts to outsource the risk of getting ganked.

So for me there is nothing which needs to be fixed. Big smile


We help your ships get traded! Pirate Ships get bought and sold more because we help eve! Twisted

Keep up the good work in EVE, an internet spaceships sandbox game!

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#517 - 2012-05-09 04:22:05 UTC
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
Lapine Davion wrote:
Here is a whine thread posted by Saia.


Your turnips are boiling.


Are you trying to say I'm mad? How can I be mad when I have a bowl of ice cream with candy in it that I am enjoying?

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#518 - 2012-05-09 04:22:54 UTC
Lapine Davion wrote:
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
Lapine Davion wrote:
Here is a whine thread posted by Saia.

Your turnips are boiling.

Are you trying to say I'm mad? How can I be mad when I have a bowl of ice cream with candy in it that I am enjoying?

What kind of ice cream and what candy?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#519 - 2012-05-09 04:44:53 UTC
Pro-tip: Everytime you say hulks need to not failfit and put on a tank, you are making the case stronger that Titan's need to get their XL gun tracking bag. Just saying...if you belive the hulk pilot needs to be pro-active and prevent from being ganked, then **** yeah you failfit subcap battleship blob pilots should be pro-active and not fly those battleships that kept getting ganked by a Titan. I mean, if that battleship dies to overwhelming Titan Alpha DPS like a hulk to a destroyer, then yeah the XL guns need their tracking back so the sub cap pilots don't bring battleships when its obviously that a cap ship has way better tank. Its not the Titan pilot's fault the guys he was shooting at had crappy ships, its the guys flying crappy ships just as much the crappy fits on the hulk.

But who the **** cares, just buff hulks shield hitpoints so the ganker can't use a destroyer as a grief tool and then add skillpoint loss when your ship is blown up like a T3. **** yeah, I want to see miners start losing something of higher value when their ship blows up to the point they don't want to mine and when the ganker can't use a destroyer...well he his pretty much slashing his wrist at the same time. Plus when they go back to null....hehe ******* awesome when hundreds of pilots lose months if not years worth of time added together in just a matter of hours Twisted

I still vote for skill point loss when your ship blows up, should be the new metric beyond isk effiency Twisted. Gank enough miners, then they will no longer mine and the problem of ganking miners will have solved itself by there being no miners to gank Blink
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#520 - 2012-05-09 04:46:20 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Lapine Davion wrote:
Saia Tae Arragosa wrote:
Lapine Davion wrote:
Here is a whine thread posted by Saia.

Your turnips are boiling.

Are you trying to say I'm mad? How can I be mad when I have a bowl of ice cream with candy in it that I am enjoying?

What kind of ice cream and what candy?


Breyers vanilla with Toffee

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]