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Can I have CQ with a window?
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Kaname Hagiri
Doomheim
#1 - 2011-10-01 07:25:45 UTC
I mean ,big french window ,through that I can see the planet and spaceships going by outside the station, just like the one in the PR movie. But the actual one came out is narrow and closed as hell, is it because some technical reason or just everyone doesn't really like windows？

I will definitely buy myself a roomy CQ with a french window if it is available on the NEX, maybe even turn the load station enviorment on sometime.
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#2 - 2011-10-01 07:29:24 UTC
Now windows allowed. Only a mirror. Don't you know windows are dangerous in space.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2011-10-01 07:33:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
Try watch fanfest 2011 i guess... That question has been answered there...

Short version .

No windows to outer-space to see whats happening outside the station in Real-Time as it would be too technically demanding to implement such thing.. Aka each CQ would have to be something like out in space capsule. Just imagine window out of Jita 4-4

Edit : Maybe in 2015 so not soon .
Brock Nelson
#4 - 2011-10-01 07:33:59 UTC
No

Signature removed, CCP Phantom
mkint
#5 - 2011-10-01 07:35:19 UTC
Brooks Puuntai wrote:
Now windows allowed. Only a mirror. Don't you know windows are dangerous in space.

wtb a screen door

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Aston Bradley
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2011-10-01 08:15:02 UTC
I think it could easaly be implemented. You just need a Looping video for the window rather than live outside view. I don't mind if the ship i see flying next to my window isn't actually there, as long as i have the impression that i can see the outside.

Right now, it's just too dark and clostrophobic.

[i]FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!

Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again![/i]
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2011-10-01 08:21:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
Aston Bradley wrote:
I think it could easaly be implemented. You just need a Looping video for the window rather than live outside view. I don't mind if the ship i see flying next to my window isn't actually there, as long as i have the impression that i can see the outside.

Right now, it's just too dark and claustrophobic.


That would be doable ... it would mean just another screen like the one already present at CQ ... but can you imagine given audience to be happy with it ? I would say there would be horrendous amount of crap called what with the window.

Followed by the group we haven't asked for any CQ in the first place, followed by the group EVE players blaming said window development to lack of EVE content / beginning with hybrids re-balancing, fail sovereignty mechanics, whatever strike them fancy.

Edit.
Also one thing in regards of physics .. / i am not an expert nor sufficiently educated in physics /

Universe is essentially darker then inside of CQ what would you actually see through the window, except some silhouettes of the ship if it were in line with sun/other light source.
Burseg Sardaukar
Free State Project
#8 - 2011-10-01 08:23:40 UTC
Is there a way to park a camera at a static place on each station and just broadcast that on a "window"? It doesn't have to be interactive, or have that big of a field of view.... nor a unique perspective for each room.

It'd be nice. Would definitely help curb any claustrophobic feelings that might be deterring CQ use.

Can't wait to dual box my Dust toon and EVE toon on the same machine!
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2011-10-01 08:31:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
Burseg Sardaukar wrote:
Is there a way to park a camera at a static place on each station and just broadcast that on a "window"? It doesn't have to be interactive, or have that big of a field of view.... nor a unique perspective for each room.

It'd be nice. Would definitely help curb any claustrophobic feelings that might be deterring CQ use.


I guess yes. Like life-stream to another screen called windows.... unique perspective wouldnt be a problem its just question of math doing so it could be done... Altho it would require some manpower to it... And i suppose we all can agree that there are more "urgent" things to look into.

Altho now that i gave it an thought..

Dont think it would be so easy... Dont now how many stations are there, but i would suggest many. Each of them would need different cam/different stream .. thats quite huge amount of data load.

Another edit... technical difficulties ... maybe 2015

As been said by CCP they had plenty of great ideas they had to abondon due to technical inferiority... aka it was technically impossible to implement at the time they had such idea... Or at least i guess i heard that somewhere
Kaname Hagiri
Doomheim
#10 - 2011-10-01 08:40:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaname Hagiri
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
Try watch fanfest 2011 i guess... That question has been answered there...

Short version .

No windows to outer-space to see whats happening outside the station in Real-Time as it would be too technically demanding to implement such thing.. Aka each CQ would have to be something like out in space capsule. Just imagine window out of Jita 4-4

Edit : Maybe in 2015 so not soon .




I don't think data load will really be the problem here.

Increasing the number of spaceships will significantly heavier the load because all these ships has to be interactive, in case of generating window view, viewer are just viewers, they don't make any effect to the space, so no more computing burden is added to the space server. And actually only one extra camera per station is needed since we don't need different view for each player. All the server need to do is boardcasting the same data to more client, and this won't take more bandwidth than normal FiS(because it IS the same data you received when you are flying). Hardly any extra burden is made to the server side.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2011-10-01 08:44:58 UTC
Kaname Hagiri wrote:
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
Try watch fanfest 2011 i guess... That question has been answered there...

Short version .

No windows to outer-space to see whats happening outside the station in Real-Time as it would be too technically demanding to implement such thing.. Aka each CQ would have to be something like out in space capsule. Just imagine window out of Jita 4-4

Edit : Maybe in 2015 so not soon .



I don't think data burden will really be the problem. It is not like increasing the number of spaceships around Jita 4-4, adding cameras in space itself doesn't generate more data , it just deliver the same data to more target(actually only one extra camera per station is needed since we don't need different view for each player). and this won't take more bandwidth than normal FiS.


Maybe ... dont know for sure. one stream per one station ... with an camera it wouldnt be transfered within in-game engine but changed to some video format and that format would be streamed towards and screen called window .. I can possibly see the data transfered for all stations would be quite large. But there is more options how to do it i am sure of it... And i think CCP gave it an thought and found out that even the least demanding option is out of reach .
Nyio
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2011-10-01 08:46:36 UTC
I have Windows.

Golem • CCP In-Game Event 2011.11.23 • Nyio • Grenade?
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2011-10-01 08:55:11 UTC
I think that all captains quarters should have huge scenery window in the roof and it should open every time when some amarrian player enters the quarters.

This would prevent overpopulation in stations and provide decent speed bumps for incoming ships.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#14 - 2011-10-01 09:02:54 UTC
Kaname Hagiri wrote:

I don't think data burden will really be the problem. It is not like increasing the number of spaceships around Jita 4-4, adding cameras in space itself doesn't generate more data , it just deliver the same data to more target(actually only one extra camera per station is needed since we don't need different view for each player). and this won't take more bandwidth than normal FiS.


that is what we call generating more data, and yes, it will slaughter bandwidth. it doesn't matter that this data is not unique and is being repeated to a few hundred people at once, because it is being repeated to a few hundred people at once through the same server. it is a big unnecessary load on the servers.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2011-10-01 09:03:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
to add to an idea of streaming video / one cam per station ...

i guess its worthy to mention that each stream will have to travel to each game client currently docked with CQ enabled. So the data transfer all over the network would be quite huge...

So we dismissed the idea beyond the camera or maybe we haven't
Question is ... How much effort it would require to change client to do stream locally. Without any network data load. And the other question for future would it be sufficient for future plans ? Like the actually interaction on station .. you invite someone to your CQ and each of you would see same thing ... well i answered that, so seems like not that bad idea.


"As i say the best option is probably what devs said at fanfest ..that it would require each client CQ to be actually unit in space. "
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#16 - 2011-10-01 09:05:59 UTC
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
to add to an idea of streaming video / one cam per station ...

i guess its worthy to mention that each stream will have to travel to each game client currently docked with CQ enabled. So the data transfer all over the network would be quite huge...

As i say the best option is probably what devs said at fanfest ..that it would require each client CQ to be actually unit in space.


which in turn adds unnecessary client-side strain on rendering giant steaming piles of data just so you can have a window and look outside.

in the end, the technical hurdles are huge and the benefit minuscule.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2011-10-01 09:19:24 UTC
updated my post which has been quoted...

Feel free to add your view to it... its only an idea, dont have a clue how much workhours would be required to do it. And i am most certein that its doable, as per rule nothing is impossible, if you claim something as being impossible you lost the battle to make it work.
Kaname Hagiri
Doomheim
#18 - 2011-10-01 09:19:48 UTC
So the limit is server bandwidth. We can have windows when the server bandwidth (not computing ability) is qualified to let all the 25000 pilots fly in space at the sametime since they are actually the same data passing on.(FiS data is way smaller than video).

25000 cannot all fly at the same time now, is this right?
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2011-10-01 09:21:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
Kaname Hagiri wrote:
So the limit is server bandwidth. We can have windows when the server bandwidth (not computing ability) is qualified to let all the 25000 pilots fly in space at the sametime since they are actually the same data passing on.(FiS data is way smaller than video).

25000 cannot all fly at the same time now, is this right?


Perceived problem .. simple fact of 25k people flying at once at one place is not equal to video stream. The server just sanding marginal data not the picture itself, the picture is rendered and provided by client ...

Sorry you mentioned that... its not that much of server bandwidth as it would take from our bandwidth too ... which shouldnt be an problem if you are not watching other streams etc.

I updated it to the fact that the camp/window transfer/recording would be done locally .. which seems like logical next step to an idea of an camera/client/CQ/window transfer.

Or the cam would actually sand the classic tags and it would be rendered at the CQ/window .. yep i can see that now.. If the outside universe runs on same engine as the CQ ..
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#20 - 2011-10-01 09:26:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Akirei Scytale
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
updated my post which has been quoted...

Feel free to add your view to it... its only an idea, dont have a clue how much workhours would be required to do it. And i am most certein that its doable, as per rule nothing is impossible, if you claim something as being impossible you lost the battle to make it work.


work hours have *nothing* to do with it. this is a problem involving rendering space *on top of the captain's quarters*, which are already a massive resource hog that have burned out GPUs in the past. it would severely diminish performance, all for a pretty window.

If you want an idea on how it will run, try opening two simultaneous EVE clients, one in CQ and one in space. That's your new baseline. Now imagine how bad it will be for the pilots that already do this all the time - the guys with 3 or 4 alts. You just doubled their pain.

and RE: bandwidth for the other method, considering a node can start crapping its pants when something like 300 pilots all decide to visit the same system and start shooting missiles, adding MORE data to the pile that CCP has been scrambling to shrink for a while now is just a bad, bad idea.
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