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Amarr assault frigates or interceptors? Pvp

Author
Gitanmaxx
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2012-04-30 05:21:56 UTC
Im looking to start using t2 frigates since I can easily take the loss of many now. Im not sure which of these two types to focus on. I know next to nothing about either. Can anyone offer me some words of wisdom. I do like the idea of using rockets just to have a change from lasers which either type has one of. Also i have very little pvp experience so I'll be learning a lot.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#2 - 2012-04-30 05:34:03 UTC
Gitanmaxx wrote:
Also i have very little pvp experience so I'll be learning a lot.

Use frigates until you learn basic PvP. Move on to ceptors or AFs when you know all about tackle, tracking, brawling, dealing with bigger ships, general mobility, gangs, missiles vs turrets, etc etc etc.

T2 ships are more specialized than their T1 versions, and are generally very good at one or two things if you do them right, and mediocre or bad otherwise. Flying them without the requisite piloting skills (not skill point skills) is, in my opinion, a waste of good money.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#3 - 2012-04-30 05:57:52 UTC
Since you asked, though, a few words on Amarr AFs and ceptors:

Retribution. Very strong AF, but its strength does not come from close-up brawling ability, but in the form of its optimal, damage, and tracking bonuses. You can easily kite enemies from outside their engagement range using Scorch ammo, and the fact that lasers can swap crystals instantly means that you don't have to wait 5 or 10 seconds to deal with someone who managed to get too close.

Vengeance. One of the tankiest AFs around. When fit with a 400mm plate, it has insane amounts of hit points, while when fit with two armor repairers you usually need more than one ship to kill it because it repairs so much. It has poor to mediocre damage, though.

Crusader. The Amarr "combat" interceptor. It is meant to fight within warp scrambler range (<10 km). Sort of a fast and furious counterpart to the Retribution, with less tank, less damage, but far faster and much smaller. Somewhat hard to fit, but fun to fly (like all combat interceptors).

Malediction. Tackle interceptor. Not very good in direct combat, since it does very little damage, but it is very fast and hard to hit, plus gets a great bonus to warp disruptor range -- allowing it to tackle things at 30+ km. See here for how not to fail at fitting one.

Again, unless you have the actual flying experience to fly these things right, please don't. You'll end up losing them horribly, even to ships a fraction of the price, sometimes. Like this. Or this. Or this.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Korvus Falek
Depraved Corruption
Lux Inter Astra
#4 - 2012-04-30 06:18:00 UTC
I personally prefer the Vengeance. I dont fly interceptors or the Retribution (except for 10 minutes one time).

I dont suggest using a 400 plate, use the ship advantages, which is its resist bonuses and capacitor. With minimal pimpage, I can get all resists to 80% or higher. I do use the atype reppers, but its worth it to me. Sometimes, Ill toss on a faction web and scram if I know Im going to fight a kiting ship, just to give myself a nasty gift of 18km web and 13-14km scram range to surprise them with.

But as others have said, dont jump into a specialized ship until you know what you want to specialize in, because you'll waste isk as well as get frustrated doing something you might not like doing and give up on the game itself.

[Vengeance, Regular]
Internal Force Field Array I
Centii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
True Sansha Energized Thermic Membrane

Gistii B-Type 1MN MicroWarpdrive
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Corpii C-Type Small Nosferatu
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket

Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst II
Small Anti-EM Pump I

And for a shameless plug, http://korvuskut.blogspot.com/ , is my blog of my fights. I have links to a few other bloggers and stuff I use often, like dotlan. I suggest checking out "Flight of Dragons" near the beginning for his "punisher plan".
Darthewok
Perkone
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-04-30 09:00:36 UTC
Consider the Navy Slicer as well. It is one of the best kiting ships around.

CAVEAT RICHARDUS VOLVERE - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-04-30 09:44:43 UTC
Korvus Falek wrote:

[Vengeance, Regular]
Internal Force Field Array I
Centii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
True Sansha Energized Thermic Membrane

Gistii B-Type 1MN MicroWarpdrive
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Corpii C-Type Small Nosferatu
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket

Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst II
Small Anti-EM Pump I


Problem going to go ahead and shamelessly use this when I get into a Vengeance sometime.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#7 - 2012-04-30 13:45:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Danny John-Peter
Firstly, the crusader should use Sorch and fight out of Scram range, not in it, you will just die to a T1 frigate.

Second all tackle Ceptors should be fitted kind of like this


[Malediction, Mal]
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II
Damage Control II

Warp Disruptor II
Coreli C-Type 1MN Microwarpdrive
Warp Scrambler II

125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I

Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I


Speed is tank and low sig, and a DC for good measure.

Oh and the Navy slicer is an awesome ship.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#8 - 2012-04-30 13:52:50 UTC
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Firstly, the crusader should use Sorch and fight out of Scram range, not in it, you will just die to a T1 frigate.

Second all tackle Ceptors should be fitted kind of like this


[Malediction, Mal]
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II
Damage Control II

Warp Disruptor II
Coreli C-Type 1MN Afterburner
Warp Scrambler II

125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I

Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I


Speed is tank and low sig, and a DC for good measure.

Oh and the Navy slicer is an awesome ship.

That fit is bad and you should feel bad. Interceptors get massive sig radius reduction for their MWDs, and you're tossing that out the window. Malediction gets bonuses to armor resistances and rocket damage, and you're tossing those out the window, too. That fit is paper thin, expensive, can't catch anything, and will die horribly to drones or even anything anything that it does catch.

Quote:
[Malediction, TACKLOR]

Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Salvager I /OFFLINE

Limited 1MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Sensor Booster II

Damage Control II
200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Adaptive Nano Plating II

Small Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Small Auxiliary Thrusters I


Half the price, far more tanky, twice the speed, target and tackle far faster, more reliable damage against drones, etc. You can feel free to fly your fit, but without the very high MWD speed or an armor tank, the Malediction becomes really vulnerable -- even if it goes 2 km/s with an AB.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#9 - 2012-04-30 13:54:12 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Firstly, the crusader should use Sorch and fight out of Scram range, not in it, you will just die to a T1 frigate.

Second all tackle Ceptors should be fitted kind of like this


[Malediction, Mal]
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II
Damage Control II

Warp Disruptor II
Coreli C-Type 1MN Afterburner
Warp Scrambler II

125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I

Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I


Speed is tank and low sig, and a DC for good measure.

Oh and the Navy slicer is an awesome ship.

That fit is bad and you should feel bad. Interceptors get massive sig radius reduction for their MWDs, and you're tossing that out the window. Malediction gets bonuses to armor resistances and rocket damage, and you're tossing those out the window, too. That fit is paper thin, expensive, can't catch anything, and will die horribly to drones or even anything anything that it does catch.

Quote:
[Malediction, TACKLOR]

Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Salvager I /OFFLINE

Limited 1MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Sensor Booster II

Damage Control II
200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Adaptive Nano Plating II

Small Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Small Auxiliary Thrusters I


Half the price, far more tanky, twice the speed, target and tackle far faster, more reliable damage against drones, etc. You can feel free to fly your fit, but without the very high MWD speed or an armor tank, the Malediction becomes really vulnerable -- even if it goes 2 km/s with an AB.


Balls, mine should have MWD, wrong one, I will edit
Lunkwill Khashour
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2012-04-30 13:55:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Lunkwill Khashour
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Firstly, the crusader should use Sorch and fight out of Scram range, not in it, you will just die to a T1 frigate.

Second all tackle Ceptors should be fitted kind of like this


[Malediction, Mal]
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II
Damage Control II

Warp Disruptor II
Coreli C-Type 1MN Afterburner
Warp Scrambler II

125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I

Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I


Speed is tank and low sig, and a DC for good measure.

Oh and the Navy slicer is an awesome ship.


1. For fighting outside scram range, the Slicer is superior to the Crusader due to optimal range bonus and the ability to fit med pulses and three rigs.

2. Y U No MWD on a tackle interceptor? Moreover a tackle interceptor doesn't need two (or even one) overdrive. It's speed is high enough to catch anything a fleet would be interested in.
Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#11 - 2012-04-30 14:00:34 UTC
Lunkwill Khashour wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Firstly, the crusader should use Sorch and fight out of Scram range, not in it, you will just die to a T1 frigate.

Second all tackle Ceptors should be fitted kind of like this


[Malediction, Mal]
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II
Damage Control II

Warp Disruptor II
Coreli C-Type 1MN Afterburner
Warp Scrambler II

125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I

Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I


Speed is tank and low sig, and a DC for good measure.

Oh and the Navy slicer is an awesome ship.


1. For fighting outside scram range, the Slicer is superior to the Crusader due to optimal range bonus and the ability to fit med pulses and three rigs.

2. Y U No MWD on a tackle interceptor? Moreover a tackle interceptor doesn't need two (or even one) overdrive. It's speed is high enough to catch anything a fleet would be interested in.


Just said, that was a mistake, meant to fit an MWD, failed epicly
Kaikka Carel
Ziea
#12 - 2012-04-30 14:01:34 UTC
I would suggest going to a test server and practice there.
Sutha Moliko
Giza'Msafara
#13 - 2012-04-30 14:54:37 UTC
Korvus Falek wrote:

[Vengeance, Regular]
Internal Force Field Array I
Centii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
True Sansha Energized Thermic Membrane

Gistii B-Type 1MN MicroWarpdrive
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Corpii C-Type Small Nosferatu
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket

Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst II
Small Anti-EM Pump I

I like your "regular" fit, well thought in order to optimize resists. However, even with All lvl5, I'm lacking 12,5 CPU. Are you offlining the NOS ?
Wait... Using your idea, I come to this fit without the troll factor Blink

[Vengeance, Regular Pimp]
Damage Control II
Corpii C-Type Small Armor Repairer
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Centii A-Type Thermic Plating

Limited 1MN MicroWarpdrive I
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator

Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Small Nosferatu II
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Inferno Rage Rocket

Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I
Small Anti-EM Pump I

About the other Amarr AF
[Retribution, PvP Nano]
Pseudoelectron Containment Field I
Tracking Enhancer II
Heat Sink II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Overdrive Injector System II

Limited 1MN MicroWarpdrive I
Faint Warp Disruptor I

Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
[empty high slot]
Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch S

Small Energy Collision Accelerator I
Small Energy Locus Coordinator I

However the Slicer is cheaper and faster. So you'd better use a Slicer to kite.
Gitanmaxx
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2012-04-30 16:24:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Gitanmaxx
Thanks everyone for the responses. This gives me good stuff to read though.

My main reason for going for a T2 frig is that I've been trying to figure out how to break into PvP and all I've been hearing is that t1 frigs and cruisers are pointless in pvp, you need to either be in t2 ships or BC and up. i can't quite afford to lose 50 mil on a BC yet because I don't get much time to play lately and make ISK.

My only PvP experience is a few runs of faction war and one week where I just threw myself in 0.0 space and went wandering around, basically just throwing myself in the deep end.

*i'm sure I'll have more questions once I have time to read through this all.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#15 - 2012-04-30 16:28:17 UTC
Gitanmaxx wrote:
all I've been hearing is that t1 frigs and cruisers are pointless in pvp, you need to either be in t2 ships or BC and up.

Absolutely false and you should smack whoever said that. So far as Amarr ships go, the Punisher, Inquisitor, Coercer, Arbitrator and Maller are all great. The Omen, too, but its fittings sort of suck so it's sort of difficult to fit.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

mxzf
Shovel Bros
#16 - 2012-04-30 16:42:01 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Gitanmaxx wrote:
all I've been hearing is that t1 frigs and cruisers are pointless in pvp, you need to either be in t2 ships or BC and up.

Absolutely false and you should smack whoever said that. So far as Amarr ships go, the Punisher, Inquisitor, Coercer, Arbitrator and Maller are all great. The Omen, too, but its fittings sort of suck so it's sort of difficult to fit.

This.

Also, an insured BC loss will typically be less than an AF loss (especially with the DED fittings many people suggest); T2 insurance is effectively non-existant.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#17 - 2012-04-30 16:44:29 UTC
mxzf wrote:
T2 insurance is effectively non-existant.

That's changed recently. A 20 mil T2 ship will usually pay about 6-8 mil in insurance, I think. Not as good as a T1 hull, but not pointless to insure it, either.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Gitanmaxx
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2012-04-30 17:27:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Gitanmaxx
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Gitanmaxx wrote:
all I've been hearing is that t1 frigs and cruisers are pointless in pvp, you need to either be in t2 ships or BC and up.

Absolutely false and you should smack whoever said that. So far as Amarr ships go, the Punisher, Inquisitor, Coercer, Arbitrator and Maller are all great. The Omen, too, but its fittings sort of suck so it's sort of difficult to fit.



Thank you for all the advice, you've been really helpful. I like my arbi a lot and the maller looked good until i tried to fit things on it, so I'll keep working on that. I just have been told so many times that t1 cruisers can't do anything in pvp especially ammarrian, but I will throw that out the window and stick with them until I have more experience.

Again I appreciate steering me in the right direction. T2 looks very expensive isk wise and I've only got about 6.5 mil sp under my belt right now.

I think once I get better I will be looking into the AFs or Interceptors because I like the idea of being the tiny ship flying around a bunch of battleships. But until then, cruiser it is. Once I get there which ship type would be most welcome in low sec corps?
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#19 - 2012-04-30 17:49:34 UTC
Gitanmaxx wrote:
Once I get there which ship type would be most welcome in low sec corps?

Depends on the corp, what they do, and what would be useful to them. Some want AFs, some want interceptors, some want both, some want neither. I recommend training whatever you like, then finding a corp that fits.

For example, my corp focuses on frigate and cruiser small gang PvP in a FW setting. T1 frigates and destroyers are great because you can just lose them infinitely and not care about the money much. Assault frigates are great as they are small but have very big damage or tank. Interceptors are great as they can catch pesky elusive ships like Amarr mission-runners. Cruisers are great because they provide above-AF performance, albeit at a lower speed, but for a fraction of the cost. And we use... all of them Pirate

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#20 - 2012-04-30 17:57:25 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Interceptors are great as they can catch pesky elusive ships like Amarr mission-runners.


Smartbombs in Hofjaldgund... just sayin

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.

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