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Viability of cheap Meta 0 fits in PVP
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Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
#1 - 2012-04-25 12:20:34 UTC
If I decide to do some PVP and hop into a frigate/dessie/cruiser with all T1, Meta0 modules do I stand any sort of chance?

The idea is that while I know I'll be inferior to a T2 fitted ship of the same caliber, I have a LOT less ISK on the line if I lose the battle, so I'm more likely to take risks and possibly catch my target off guard.

My question is: Even if I catch my target off guard, will my meta 0 ship stand any chance against a T2 fitted pvp ship?



Note: I'm not talking about cheap suicide gank ships. I'm talking of combat against other ships that can shoot back.

In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse.

Nalha Saldana
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-04-25 12:23:38 UTC
You can always kill stuff that you can get under the guns of. Any other frigate or destroyer you find thats got t2 mods will probably destroy you very fast.
Make sure to kill drones fast and use a afterburner fit.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#3 - 2012-04-25 12:28:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanya Powers
if it's a cheapo throwaway frigate doesn't really matter how long you can last but how much fun you get from using it, and when it's cheapo it's hellah funny, bring some friends with same kind of stuff and actually enjoy pvp in group, the awesome laughs on vocal even when you loose it doing stupid stuff Lol

imho this is where Eve became the most fun game I've ever played, and sometimes you can manage to outgun/win fights vs T2 ships/guns because when you have some experience, well, sometimes this worth thousands more than any sp or officer/faction mods you can put in your slots.
Andrea Griffin
#4 - 2012-04-25 13:37:46 UTC
Yes, actually - though you're going to need to engage the right targets, or be a much better pilot than the other guy.

The SoE Full Metal Jacket competition was a RvB style competition - two corporations at war, however, your character couldn't be more than a day or two old when the competition started. So everyone was fighting with really young, inexperienced characters. When there wasn't much action going on, we'd roam around and look for trouble.

Anyway, there was a can fight guy in Amarr. An older character, 3-4 years old or so in a T2 fit Punisher. I was in a cheapo, T-1 fit rifter. I took the can, we fought, and I ended up winning. It was really close - but there you go.

During my days as an active pirate with the Blood Money Cartel, we regularly recruited new pilots, gave them some cheap fits for learning, and sent them out into the field to see what would happen. It was amazing what some of the younger guys would engage and take down with their cheap fits.

However - those are the exceptions rather than the rule. T2 provides a significant bonus over T1 (especially meta-0), moreso when you take good skills into account and the flexibility of certain T2 ammunition. You CAN win an engagement but the deck is definitely stacked against you.

Meta-1 and Meta-2 stuff is usually really cheap (sometimes cheaper than Meta-0), so consider bumping your fits up a little. Every little bit helps.

At the same time, a cheap ship is cheap - so you can afford to throw them at everything you see and find out what sticks. And sometimes you'll get really lucky - some guy with a terribad fit or no experience and you'll eat him up. Your best bet is a few posts up: Find a larger class ship (cruiser, battleship), get under the guns, shoot down the drones, and wear your opponent down.

CCP Sreegs is my favorite developer.
Darthewok
Perkone
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-04-25 15:40:29 UTC
It is possible but such low win probability that your ship losses would cancel out your module savings.

CAVEAT RICHARDUS VOLVERE - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
Aluka 7th
#6 - 2012-04-25 16:30:53 UTC
You can buy higher meta items i.e. meta 1 and meta 2 for less money than meta 0 and they are best isk:value ratio..
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
#7 - 2012-04-25 16:38:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Kahega Amielden
Aluka 7th wrote:
You can buy higher meta items i.e. meta 1 and meta 2 for less money than meta 0 and they are best isk:value ratio..


This. A lot of meta items are dirt cheap and just better.
Nate Nichols
GWA Corp
#8 - 2012-04-25 17:27:02 UTC
What are meta items?

I've seen the meta description on items but never understood what it meant.
Skorpynekomimi
#9 - 2012-04-25 18:29:56 UTC
Meta 1 and 2 may be cheaper, but it's a LOT harder obtaining them in quantity.

Especially as an industrialist, when you can just run off a bunch from a BPO.

Economic PVP
Demieta
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-04-25 18:47:20 UTC
Nate Nichols wrote:
What are meta items?

I've seen the meta description on items but never understood what it meant.


If you look at the show info of an item in the attributes section, you'll see a field called meta. That value basically shows the incremental improvement over the basic tech 1 module. Meta values 1-4 are the named modules you'll find in the market, 5 is T2, 8-10 is faction, and higher are deadspace/office mods (as I recall off the top of my head).

For example, the first 5 meta levels for standard missile launchers goes:

Standard Missile Launcher 1 - Meta 0
Malkuth Standard Missile Launcher - Meta 1
Limo Standard Missile Launcher - Meta 2
TE-2100 Standard Missile Launcher - Meta 3
Arbalest Standard Missile Launcher - Meta 4
Standard Missile Launcher II - Meta 5
Katalci
Kismesis
#11 - 2012-04-25 22:40:50 UTC
You only stand a chance against idiots.
Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-04-25 23:48:28 UTC
I wouldn't try it solo, but a small to medium sized group of meta 0 equipped ships can be fairly hilarious. I remember southern cross empire would fly in groups of 10-15 tech 1 cruisers, all with meta0 items and if they all died and killed one hac it was a gigantic win for them in terms of isk efficiency. Plus it sounded like they had lots of fun :)
Nonnosa
420 Enterprises.
#13 - 2012-04-26 01:22:47 UTC
Nate Nichols wrote:
What are meta items?

I've seen the meta description on items but never understood what it meant.


Select a ship module and click 'information' At the bottom of the variations tab is a Compare button. This menu lets you organise items by fitting, effect, meta level etc...

Meta 0 (Tech 1) and meta 5 (tech 2) items are produced by players. All others are only found as loot from NPCs in missons, ratting and complexes. The exception being story line modules which are (only? ) produced by Blueprints and components found in the Cosmos missions.
Cedo Nulli
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2012-04-26 03:43:28 UTC
Pinstar Colton wrote:
If I decide to do some PVP and hop into a frigate/dessie/cruiser with all T1, Meta0 modules do I stand any sort of chance?



You dont ... unless you can field full t2 fits ... you will be blown out of the sky without much chance of winning. You can assume that the enemy allready knows what your flying thanks to his scouts ... has t3 booster ... and has fitted a faction killmachine to take you out.
Darthewok
Perkone
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-04-26 06:26:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Darthewok
Frigs/Dessies/Cruisers well-fit are already almost irrelevant in PVP.
It is extremely common to see AFs/BCs/BS/CS/HACs/Recons/T3 cruisers everywhere.
And they will be T2 or faction fit.

You want to cheap fit them as well?
Good luck finding winnable fights.

CAVEAT RICHARDUS VOLVERE - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#16 - 2012-04-26 10:13:43 UTC
Pinstar Colton wrote:
If I decide to do some PVP and hop into a frigate/dessie/cruiser with all T1, Meta0 modules do I stand any sort of chance?

The idea is that while I know I'll be inferior to a T2 fitted ship of the same caliber, I have a LOT less ISK on the line if I lose the battle, so I'm more likely to take risks and possibly catch my target off guard.

My question is: Even if I catch my target off guard, will my meta 0 ship stand any chance against a T2 fitted pvp ship?



Note: I'm not talking about cheap suicide gank ships. I'm talking of combat against other ships that can shoot back.



Meta 1-2 mods are often cheaper than meta 0

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016