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Indy Corp Advice

Author
NOOBIE CORP
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-04-13 15:52:49 UTC
I'm planning on starting an industrial corp for new players that focuses on manufacturing tech I items, soon. I've run corps before, but none on the scale that I intend this one to reach (and none were too indy focused).

This corp is also going to serve as an experiment for a blog I'm writing to help new CEOs.

What advice is out there for setting-up and running a manufacturing corp?

I'd appreciate all the help I can get :)

Visit the CEO Guide, a blog and resource hub for corporations.

www.eveceoguide.com

Ackemi
The Gaming Avenue
Shadow Ultimatum
#2 - 2012-04-13 16:37:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Ackemi
Just my uninformed (never ran a purely industrial corp), unprofessional (I'm a casual Eve player), and thankfully solicited opinion:

You have to offer your corpies something of value to the profession of manufacturing that they would have to work harder to obtain on their own. Either supply, lines, POS, prints/research, logistics, or marketing. Hopefully you provide/maintain all the other good social aspect reasons for forming a corp like companionship, education and fun along with the good gameplay reasons for forming a corp like lower overall taxes, effectiveness toward reaching goals, and generally giving as good as you get when Eve hands you that lemon (group wise).

You need to provide those things with a net corp isk value. Spreadsheets don't lie and industrialists like their spreadsheets (everything has to be transparent).

There is not a whole bunch "game mechanics wise" that will cause industrialist to want to clump together vs doing their own thing. Generally speaking most of the benefit wil be for newer members. Retention of experienced corp members may become an issue. Most industry is a side job for pilots in Eve as they are busy doing something else or are in a corp that doesn't have a laser focus in industry.

You are going to run into problems with serious industrialists wanting to run POS for lower build times and not wanting to spread those corp titles around to so many people.

You are going to run into problems with serious industry taking serious capital. Sooner or later serious capital causes serious loss due to corp theft.

You are going to run into problems if the things your corp provides to industrialists don't seem like everyone is gaining benefits equally from. This is of course subjective to each members opinion.



I probably haven't provided you with any useful specific ideas, but generalities can be useful.


Edited for clarity.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#3 - 2012-04-13 16:47:47 UTC
Ackemi is pretty much dead-on. However, that being said ... Escalation (and Inferno) will help you in this regard -- if you can get some other PvP guys involved who see the value of protecting their slav... erm industrialists, in return for cheap ships your corp will flourish.

The trick is getting the miners/industrialists to see the value in selling you trit at (for example) 5 ISK when they could sell it on the market for 6 ... and getting the PvP guys to want to do "boring" things...

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Kalipoli
State War Academy
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-04-13 17:18:56 UTC
The best advice i can give has probably already been given.

The problem i ran into with my corp was exactly what the previous poster said, why would they sell to you instead of straight to the market. you have to setup some sort of incentives and remind your members from time to time that the collective is capable of far more than the individual. Make your ore buy programs fair, never more than a few percentage below jita buy tend to work well but it will be up to you to decide that.

Another thing is to have missioners and pvpers in corp, one for loot, you can use loot to suppliment free goods for the corp members. second for security, an indy corp with no teeth will be a target all the time.

Third a POS. one of the best things you can offer indy chars that you are recruiting, if you can offer research labs it will entice new indy members for sure.

Fourth, understand that by being the CEO of a large corp that its success or failure ultimately relies on you and a couple other individuals. If you are unable to keep things in order your corp will fail, if you dont have good directors you will fail. if you cant do a spreadsheet you will fail. Also understand that with EVE if you are CEO it will consume quite a bit of your time and can easily be a second job that you are getting paid for other than isk, which depends on your organization and spreadsheets and directors.

Offer as many free or discounted goods as you can for corp members and have clear goals set that anyone in the corp who is helping can help achieve. Dont make to strict of goals as the market changes quite a bit.

Encourage Indy members to do some missioning as well when they are not mining or building to help build standings to reduce costs for refining.

There is a lot more, CEO is a tough job but if you are organized and know EVE well you can be very very very successful and have isk just dying to be spent.

Set Goals, Organize Goals, Delegate Goals, Make S@#$ tons of spreadsheets and Conquer.
Ackemi
The Gaming Avenue
Shadow Ultimatum
#5 - 2012-04-13 17:36:02 UTC
I guess after reading the blog and some of the replies I need to clarify my viewpoint!

I view industry as it's own profession, mining is another valid profession, and they are separated by the Eve market (with marketing being a third valid profession). Some of my advice was skewed for my viewpoint.

It's important to keep them separate! Even within your corp business plan.




Mining corporations in Eve seem to have a well defined business plan and structure. Industrial focused corps are more grey areas waiting in the wings...

Lol
NOOBIE CORP
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-04-13 18:51:39 UTC
Awesome, thanks for the input guys :)

To be honest, I wasn't sure what kind of response I would get from these forums. I was halfway expecting to get trolled all to hell. Glad there are people here willing to offer good advice

"Ackemi" wrote:
You have to offer your corpies something of value to the profession of manufacturing that they would have to work harder to obtain on their own. Either supply, lines, POS, prints/research, logistics, or marketing... There is not a whole bunch "game mechanics wise" that will cause industrialist to want to clump together vs doing their own thing.


^^^ This is an excellent point. After I figured out most of the game mechanics beginners are familiar with, I really could not find a reason to band industrialists together unless you had access to nullsec and enough D to protect them. This became an issue in my first corp almost as soon as I started it. Anytime a prospective recruit asked me "what do I get out of being in your corp," I really didn't know what to tell them aside from "you'll make friends?

The only way I can see people being able to profit from being purely indy now is, like you said, offering good logi/research/marketing/POS/etc. But still, there's the issue with players eventually being able to provide all of those things by themselves. I think that's what you were trying to explain with your point here:

"Ackemi" wrote:
Retention of experienced corp members may become an issue. Most industry is a side job for pilots in Eve as they are busy doing something else or are in a corp that doesn't have a laser focus in industry.


Therefore, aside from established players being generous to new players, the only point I see in having an indy corp is for new toons to split their training ques to cover different process of production. I'm not sure where a corp would go from there once those skills are maxed, though, which I imagine is bound to happen eventually. Otherwise, it seems like the risk of a wardec just isn't worth it, and it's better for indy players to fly solo.

Of course, I've been playing for just a few weeks now, so I'm not going to pretend I'm an expert on what I'm talking about. These are just observations.

"Velicitia" wrote:
However, that being said ... Escalation (and Inferno) will help you in this regard -- if you can get some other PvP guys involved who see the value of protecting their slav... erm industrialists, in return for cheap ships your corp will flourish.


^^^ That's my plan atm, I'm just not sure the best way to go about it. Should I find an established corp to sell to in exchange for defense, or should I start a sister PvP corp to help us stay better organized? What's been most successful for you?

Also, I haven't had time to read up on all the features of the new versions of EVE (totally about to go do that now, though). Just in case I don't find what you're talking about though, what do you mean here about Escalation and Inferno helping indies?

"Velicitia" wrote:
The trick is getting the miners/industrialists to see the value in selling you trit at (for example) 5 ISK when they could sell it on the market for 6 ... and getting the PvP guys to want to do "boring" things...


What's your trick? If you don't mind me asking :)

"Kalipoli" wrote:
Another thing is to have missioners and pvpers in corp, one for loot, you can use loot to suppliment free goods for the corp members. second for security, an indy corp with no teeth will be a target all the time.


My previous corp also had both indy and PvP (and PvE (and just about everything else, really)). I found the organization of even just indy and PvP in the same corp to be very difficult, especially during wardecs.

Also, even though we had a dozen or so PvP guys, enemy pilots still tore us apart because we were new toons. I guess it's just a bad idea in general to ever recruit PvP guys who haven't been around a few months unless you already have the numbers to both defend your indies and train your PvP noobs.

Thanks again for replying :)

Visit the CEO Guide, a blog and resource hub for corporations.

www.eveceoguide.com

Ackemi
The Gaming Avenue
Shadow Ultimatum
#7 - 2012-04-13 19:08:27 UTC
I'll offer another nice little grain of sand to put in that oyster!



As a CEO it's a good idea to ask for and expect certain things from your corpies, but I will say the line has to be drawn at demanding or directly suggesting training certain skills. That has never gone well. Especially new characters who want to experience as much of Eve in as short a time as possible.

If it's wholly their choice it's great -> As soon as they think you have influenced their SP training for your (or the corps) benefit some creative dis-associative thinking happens and all the sudden you have a riot!

You can however offer some incentive for someone to fill an SP niche the corp is missing. Let them retroactively train toward it and then they get the good feeling of accomplishing something for the corp. Only the people who would have trained that anyhow will be the ones to do that for the corp; so you don't get the riot effect.
Lauren Hellfury
Super Happy Awesome Fun Times
#8 - 2012-04-13 19:15:35 UTC
Most of the benefits that can be offered require extra work on your part


1) Get perfect refining (skills and standings) and offer a corp reproc service with a 5% tax on recovered minerals (or whatever % you like, just don't set it higher than a zero standing "we take" figure

They dump cans of ore/modules named after their character into a corp hangar. You grab the can, reproc and stick the minerals back in the can minus the corp tax

You have to remember that these miners will be getting perfect skilled reproc themselves as they progress so the selling point needs to be the lack of need to grind standings with a corporation close by to 6.66

You can then use those materials as you see fit to benefit the corp


2) Free PVP stuffs for during wardecs. Create a simple decent fit (or steal one from somewhere), preferably frigate hull. Then keep a nice large stock of them and fittings. Use cans to store a hull+mods. Ensure all members train to use these modules

You're not gonna win many fights like this but your corp members won't be losing anything during a wardec either. If you can't be arsed hauling and selling the minerals from the reproc tax then just grab the T1 BPOs for those items and research the crap out of them. Then, when/if a wardec hits everyone grabs a free ship, gets onto vocom and pisses around having a laugh


3) Pre-researched BPO collection available for use. Store the BPOs in appropriately named corp hangars and only give "view" access to people. They can then request copies to use (you'll have to have a research char or two for making the copies). Either charge a fee for the copies or encourage donations from profit

You can even then sell these to corp members as their funds grow. It will also encourage a bit of competition between members since once sold it will take some time for a new researched one to be placed ready for use again. In effect they buy a patent from you for a set period of time knowing that anyone else in the corp without their own version can't compete with them.




There are many other things that you can do but the above should give you a push in the right direction.

Help rid New Eden of T2 BPOs: ** https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=62797 **The Full Pocket Aggro blog:  http://fullpocketaggro.blogspot.com/ **Now showing: **Margin Trading Scams

NOOBIE CORP
Doomheim
#9 - 2012-04-14 05:25:37 UTC
@ Ackemi - True, asking members to train certain skills has to be done carefully, but I've had several members specifically ask me what they should train for to help the corp. And I'm curious, what sort have riots have you seen before.

@ Lauren - Those are some very cool ideas, especially the BPO licenses. Things like that, that offer suggestions not only about what I should/shouldn't be doing as a new CEO, but also ways (how) I could go about doing them are what I'm really digging for here.

Visit the CEO Guide, a blog and resource hub for corporations.

www.eveceoguide.com

Styth spiting
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-04-14 06:27:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Styth spiting
NOOBIE CORP wrote:
I'm planning on starting an industrial corp for new players that focuses on manufacturing tech I items, soon. I've run corps before, but none on the scale that I intend this one to reach (and none were too indy focused).

This corp is also going to serve as an experiment for a blog I'm writing to help new CEOs.

What advice is out there for setting-up and running a manufacturing corp?

I'd appreciate all the help I can get :)


1. Get high enough standing with a faction so you can easily and quickly put up / take down POS's in high sec (meaning don't depend on buying a corp and taking advantage of previous made standings exploit). You will need to be able to take down and put up as wardecs happen (and they will happen often).

2. Manufacturing/research only takes up a very small amount of time, so chances are most of your members will be mission runners or miners. So a good setup for corp ops will need to be in place (mining ops, mission ops, etc).

3.Do a lot of research before hand and make so you can offer information that is not normally (or easily) available to players in regards to what skills to train, in what order and why specific training paths would be best. for example why training the ability to use veldspar mining crystals II right after you can fly a Retreiver is more important than simply training up to a covetor. Same goes with PI, R&D, making BPC's while training up research / manufacturing skills, import ants of spreadsheets, etc etc.

4,5,6,7,8. Ore buying program (5%), access to POS's, buying pre-researched BPC's at a good price (work in a BPO selling program based on them selling miners from ops?), ship replacements, TS3 server, good website / forum and obviously the ability to have a fun time. with starting a crop you're going to be eating alot of costs to help keep your members playing and in your corp, so make sure you have alot of isk available.

This is what I would do / plan for if I were to start a corp.
D3F4ULT
#11 - 2012-04-14 06:39:14 UTC
Best way to get newbs into corp.

Have better refining skills, be able to haul for them, buy them shiny stuff.


Being a good corp leader with newer players will mean you're probably going to be hitting for losses in personal revenue. Though if you create a vibrant atmosphere where you help tremendously and are always there when they need it. They will remember that and stick around.

You have to give them things that other corps can't give, and that's going to be YOUR time.

"Bow down before the one you serve, you're going to get what you deserve"

Styth spiting
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-04-14 08:06:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Styth spiting
Kalipoli wrote:

The problem i ran into with my corp was exactly what the previous poster said, why would they sell to you instead of straight to the market



Not trying to hijack this thread, but thought this was a pretty important thing to touch on

there are several reasons I can think of why you would want to sell to your corp for a lesser value than current market value (normally refereed to as an ore buying program)

1. You were part of a mining OP with the corp. You received 50% increase in yield from Orca + hauling to station + perfect refine + lowest possible tax + hauling to market + sold at the highest value for the minerals. Making 80% + profit yield to time ratio with no additional work or time for 5% - 10% tax from the corp is not a bad deal

2. If you do not have perfect refine and standings. If you're going to pay 10% in waste /tax you're better off giving the 10% to the corp

3. If you don't have the ability to haul to market. And a basic industrial doesn't count. An industrial will only get you to a station to sell, but chances are it's not a market hub so your not going to get the best price. If you mine for several hours you'll be making several trips. For example if it takes you more than 1 hour to haul 10 hours of mining yield to station for max selling value then you are better off selling to corp (since it will profit you). Also the time spent hauling could be instead spent mining. If you can mine say 25m isk worth of minerals per hour selling 250m isk worth of minerals to the corp would be a break even point for you (and saving you the time of hauling / chance of having your hauler destroyed)

4. You get to mine and not deal with hauling, training a hauler, or taking the chance of losing a hauler moving to station

5. Lazy. You just want isk and not deal with the 1 thing that is more boring and these days as dangerous (if not more dangerous) then mining, which is hauling

6. Corp support. Your corp needs to make money some how, and selling to the corp in most situations helps you as well as helping your corp


Simple way to figure out if selling to your corp is worth it
If (mineral sell value - (your hauling time * yield per hour)) > (jita buy price - corp tax

So for example you mine veldspar for 10 hours with an average hourly yield of 25m isk per hour for a total of 250m isk in the Tash-murkon region (trit is 5.90). It will take you 1 hour to sell locally, or 2 hours to sell to jita (trit 6.2, a +12m profit)
235.
Your corp buys at jita prices and take 10%.The corp would take 26.2m isk with you receiving 236.4m isk. You receive -13.5m less isk. But even though you just made -13.5m isk less, you also saved 1 hour of time, plus no worries of ship loss hauling. If you were to mine during this 1 hour time (instead of hauling) you would actually have made 11.4m isk more selling to corp

You also save in other areas as well. For example you don't need to buy an Orca for hauling (700m isk) or freighter (1.2b) , the skills to fly an orca (20+ days), do not need to train the market skills to save on taxes/broker. Do not need to mission for standing (30+ hours, -750m isk lost to mining time), and if you're a new player you can focus on skills to increase yield instead of refining

So to recap. If you have perfect refine + standings and an Orca / freighter and plan to haul AFK you may break even, otherwise chances are selling to your corp is most likely better.
NOOBIE CORP
Doomheim
#13 - 2012-04-14 22:31:18 UTC
Awesome. Excellent advice, thanks everyone :)

Visit the CEO Guide, a blog and resource hub for corporations.

www.eveceoguide.com

Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#14 - 2012-04-17 06:30:26 UTC
Adding to previous advice:

Choose a style of government/leadership.

It should be number one thing you do and it should be in your corps description.

Don't choose the style based on what you think other players want.
Base it on what you're willing to manage.
If you don't it will drive you crazy. It will make you work harder or in ways you never wanted to do.
If your a dictator be a dictator. If you want to lead a democratic group with votes then do it.
If you join an alliance look for something you can deal with personaly. Confederacy, fuedal, republic?

You can try to ignore all this and go for the pure blob mentality but that group already has a lot to chose from.
D Program
#15 - 2012-04-17 08:22:17 UTC
Nice topic. Very nice ideas here.

What is this sorcery?

http://www.eve-cost.eu

Velicitia
XS Tech
#16 - 2012-04-17 12:51:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Velicitia
NOOBIE CORP wrote:

^^^ That's my plan atm, I'm just not sure the best way to go about it. Should I find an established corp to sell to in exchange for defense, or should I start a sister PvP corp to help us stay better organized? What's been most successful for you

Also, I haven't had time to read up on all the features of the new versions of EVE (totally about to go do that now, though). Just in case I don't find what you're talking about though, what do you mean here about Escalation and Inferno helping indies


You could sell to an established PvP corp, sure ... though the thing is, they might not be around when you need them. I find it's easier to work directly with PvP guys in your corp. Trick with this is you have to live somewhere near where they want to go play (i.e. near a decent lowsec area)

Escalation is taking out Meta0 trash from rats (everywhere) and also removing the drone poo (replacing it with bounties). Since Meta0 has the most minerals when you melt it down (compared to Meta 1-4), the glut of minerals we see on the markets from missioners is going to go away. Drone poo isn't "as big" in empire, but it did drive down the prices of high-ends.

Now, because the PvPers with a side job of mission running can't get minerals as easily, it means that the only ("good") sources of materials are from the guys who can mine ... and if a corp has no industrial capacity, well, they're at the mercy of the markets. And they're not very merciful right now Twisted

NOOBIE CORP wrote:


What's your trick? If you don't mind me asking :



Pretty much nothing right now ... we're a little older and space-rich so people don't rely on the corp for everything -- pretty much corp stuff is "special need" or where the market is getting silly (e.g. if someone wants a freighter). However, for starting out (like you seem to be) ... a few other carrots could be used

- access to researched BPOs, the more expensive, the better (frigs/ammo are nice, but anyone can scrounge up a few million to buy a few .. the point where people go "oh god, it costs THAT MUCH?!" is where the corp prints are a better carrot

- cheap ships (PvP guys will love this)
- free ammo

Looking at a Myrmidon (I loved mine for L3 missioning), it costs ~55m ISK to buy in Jita. Assuming we're running L3 missions, we're getting ~5m ISK/mission (assuming you can run 3 missions/hour and you're averaging 15m ISK/hour. It's been a long time since I've run missions, so I don't know how far off these numbers are).

A missioner needs 3-4 hours in order to replace just the hull. Fittings will probably add another 15-20m to the hull ... so another 1.5-2 hours...

50m ISK to build (assuming ME20 print, and buy orders in The Forge).

Flying a Covetor, no gang bonuses, and T1 strips will get you ~1100 m3 ore per minute. It'll take you 3 hours (best case) to mine all the lowends. So, you come to an agreement with the indy guy to sell him the lowends for a little less, he agrees to sell the Missioner/PvPer the ship for a little less, and in all it takes 8 man-hours to get this guy in a ship for say 50m (with everyone profiting)

Now, in 2 weeks when you get dec'd ... the corp (and pilots) are all a little more space-rich than they would have been ... and because you have been working together, you're all more willing to come out and shoot

Miner --> faster we kill these doods, faster I can get back to work Big smile
Mfg --> faster we kill these doods, faster I can get more mins Big smile
PvP --> faster we kill these doods, faster I can get my ships replaced Big smile

NOOBIE CORP wrote:


My previous corp also had both indy and PvP (and PvE (and just about everything else, really)). I found the organization of even just indy and PvP in the same corp to be very difficult, especially during wardecs.

Also, even though we had a dozen or so PvP guys, enemy pilots still tore us apart because we were new toons. I guess it's just a bad idea in general to ever recruit PvP guys who haven't been around a few months unless you already have the numbers to both defend your indies and train your PvP noobs

Thanks again for replying :)


Meh, ship losses are learning experiences. Frigates are also so easy to build that for the same amount of time your miner was working (3hours), you can mine enough ore for just about 100 tristans (3h 10m best-case scenario for 100). And as rookies, if you guys have 100 tristans (even with Meta0 fittings) sitting around waiting for that wardec to come in ... well, someone's gonna realise that they picked on the wrong corp. You just all have to be able to work together (eve-voice helps a lot, if you don't have TS) and not do completely stupid things, such as go 1 on 1 with the other guys.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#17 - 2012-04-17 15:17:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Xuixien
Ireland VonVicious wrote:
Adding to previous advice:

Choose a style of government/leadership.

It should be number one thing you do and it should be in your corps description.

Don't choose the style based on what you think other players want.
Base it on what you're willing to manage.
If you don't it will drive you crazy. It will make you work harder or in ways you never wanted to do.
If your a dictator be a dictator. If you want to lead a democratic group with votes then do it.
If you join an alliance look for something you can deal with personaly. Confederacy, fuedal, republic?

You can try to ignore all this and go for the pure blob mentality but that group already has a lot to chose from.


This. 10x this.

OP - if you have never been in a leadership position then you are about to learn a lot about yourself.

I've learned that I'm more of a dictatorial leader than anything else. And I've learned that, unless you can brainwash your group, the dictatorial leader style needs to be tempered with goodwill towads your people and a willingness to be a bastard or a saint in their best interests. You need to take a "Hippocratic Oath" to "do no harm" to your corp. These are your people and they are looking to you for security and guidance.

Attention Whatever happens, the welfare of your people comes first. End of story.
Attention Do not just tell your people what to do. If you're telling them what to do, or what's going to be done, tell them why it's being done. Keep them in the loop with as much as you can afford to keep them in the loop on.
AttentionGroom your membership. You will reach a point where you will need "2nds in command", even if it's only 1 or 2. Learn to identify members with leadership qualities and see if you can encourage them to develop these skills. You will also begin to identify players with certain interests and talents - help them cultivate these interests and talents. Strong members make for a strong corp because the corp is it's members.
Attention Develop personal relationships with as many members as you can, even if it's on the most rudimentary and casual level. Ask your members how they're doing and care about the answer.
Attention And last but certainly not least: trust your members. Members who are trusted by their leaders become loyal. But be smart about it - only trust your members with access to what they created to mitigate damage if someone does go postal. You have to protect your people, and part of this is making sure that one person cannot hurt everyone in the corp if he betrays you.

As far as the logistics - that's already been covered. Get perfect refining and refine for your members @ 2% tax. As time goes on, let someone else take over that job - they keep 1% for themselves and give 1% tot he corp. Buyback minerals at a fair value - if you have an orca + boosting, it's fair to buyback at 90% Jita value, because your people will be mining 50% more than they would solo. You can also do mineral sell-backs: Since you bought the minerals at below Jita value, you can sell them to your manufacturers at below Jita value. Let people use the POS remotely (from the corp hangar) but charge half the operating cost of the POS to rent a line. This will generate some income and it's fair because they don't have to wait 30 days at a public station and they're paying to keep the POS running. Have some public BPOs locked down in a hangar. Offer free ships and reimbursement for corp operations - if you want someone to scout a null-sec or lo-sec system, give them the ship to do it in. Let the corp absorb the member's losses, because the corp will be absorbing a % of member profit - it's only fair.

And remember a good ecology of money: Whatever the corp takes, it must give back.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

clixor
Celluloid Gurus
#18 - 2012-04-18 22:33:35 UTC  |  Edited by: clixor
A lot has been covered here, but i think one really important aspect in making a indy corp succesfull is creating common goals.

Every member can have his/her own role and personal stuff but for instance provide bonusses, or arrange payouts based on corp profits. This way you'll get some 'social control' and don't have to correct less active members which, one way or another, will lead to friction in the end.

Another thing what has been mentioned here are corp buy orders. I wouldn't go about and try to handle everything seperately, this eats into your available time FAST. f.i. for refining, setup corp buy orders for minerals. You can make a shitload of corp orders so f.i. you can setup higher volumes for better rates giving corp members an incentive to either work more or don't deliver everyting in tiny seperate portions.

If you've got a shipprogram, put up those as well as orders.
Megos Adriano
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2012-04-19 19:02:08 UTC
Stork CEO best CEO.

Xuixien wrote:
Ireland VonVicious wrote:
Adding to previous advice:

Choose a style of government/leadership.

It should be number one thing you do and it should be in your corps description.

Don't choose the style based on what you think other players want.
Base it on what you're willing to manage.
If you don't it will drive you crazy. It will make you work harder or in ways you never wanted to do.
If your a dictator be a dictator. If you want to lead a democratic group with votes then do it.
If you join an alliance look for something you can deal with personaly. Confederacy, fuedal, republic?

You can try to ignore all this and go for the pure blob mentality but that group already has a lot to chose from.


This. 10x this.

OP - if you have never been in a leadership position then you are about to learn a lot about yourself.

I've learned that I'm more of a dictatorial leader than anything else. And I've learned that, unless you can brainwash your group, the dictatorial leader style needs to be tempered with goodwill towads your people and a willingness to be a bastard or a saint in their best interests. You need to take a "Hippocratic Oath" to "do no harm" to your corp. These are your people and they are looking to you for security and guidance.

Attention Whatever happens, the welfare of your people comes first. End of story.
Attention Do not just tell your people what to do. If you're telling them what to do, or what's going to be done, tell them why it's being done. Keep them in the loop with as much as you can afford to keep them in the loop on.
AttentionGroom your membership. You will reach a point where you will need "2nds in command", even if it's only 1 or 2. Learn to identify members with leadership qualities and see if you can encourage them to develop these skills. You will also begin to identify players with certain interests and talents - help them cultivate these interests and talents. Strong members make for a strong corp because the corp is it's members.
Attention Develop personal relationships with as many members as you can, even if it's on the most rudimentary and casual level. Ask your members how they're doing and care about the answer.
Attention And last but certainly not least: trust your members. Members who are trusted by their leaders become loyal. But be smart about it - only trust your members with access to what they created to mitigate damage if someone does go postal. You have to protect your people, and part of this is making sure that one person cannot hurt everyone in the corp if he betrays you.

As far as the logistics - that's already been covered. Get perfect refining and refine for your members @ 2% tax. As time goes on, let someone else take over that job - they keep 1% for themselves and give 1% tot he corp. Buyback minerals at a fair value - if you have an orca + boosting, it's fair to buyback at 90% Jita value, because your people will be mining 50% more than they would solo. You can also do mineral sell-backs: Since you bought the minerals at below Jita value, you can sell them to your manufacturers at below Jita value. Let people use the POS remotely (from the corp hangar) but charge half the operating cost of the POS to rent a line. This will generate some income and it's fair because they don't have to wait 30 days at a public station and they're paying to keep the POS running. Have some public BPOs locked down in a hangar. Offer free ships and reimbursement for corp operations - if you want someone to scout a null-sec or lo-sec system, give them the ship to do it in. Let the corp absorb the member's losses, because the corp will be absorbing a % of member profit - it's only fair.

And remember a good ecology of money: Whatever the corp takes, it must give back.

And boom goes the dynamite.

Karn Dulake
Doomheim
#20 - 2012-04-19 21:36:14 UTC
Make sure you are posting on this forum with an alt

otherwise you have just put yourself up as an easy mark

Good luck
I dont normally troll, but when i do i do it on General Discussion.