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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Dumb idea: Necromancers

Author
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#1 - 2012-04-17 14:45:25 UTC
It's kind of silly but the thought just struck me, maybe a good T2 role for the poor, underappreciate T1 mining frigates... the ability to revive downed ships.

Mechanics:

  • These ships could carry a resurrection module that uses ship control drones or something for a charge.
  • The size/number of the ships that it can control depends on its skill specialization.
  • Resurrected ships are controlled like drones
  • The modules a resurrected ship can use are the ones that would appear in wreckage (not destroyed). These items are locked from the wreck until control of it is lost.
  • The duration, health and effectiveness of wreck command depends on skill training.
  • Taking control of a wreck requires some time, making the necromancer ship vulnerable and to prevent some abuse.
  • Some ships can not be raised, particularly freighters, to prevent abuse.
  • A second destruction of the wreck has another chance to lose dropped items, requiring a decision on what to take from a wreck before raising it.
  • Wrecks probably shouldn't accept remote repair.
  • Logistics modules should be available as a drone control option, "Attack this" "Support this"
  • The modules on a resurrected ship might require the abilities of the necromancer pilot, so alts can't be used to take control of T2 blasters or anything.
  • Wrecks should follow the necromancer ship in warp.
  • NPC wrecks should be controllable to give these ships PvE capabilities.


Gameplay changes:

  • Salvaging during combat or obliterating wrecks becomes tactically significant
  • More skills to train
  • Where you choose to die is important
  • More consumables to spend money on
  • More things to build
  • Added incentive for high-skill modules, both to use and to train for
  • Scanning ship fittings during combat may help
  • More loot will be lost
  • Wrecks can be tactically relocated for salvaging purposes
  • More tears will be available for harvesting when carebears are attacked by their own ships.
Buzzy Warstl
Quantum Flux Foundry
#2 - 2012-04-17 15:06:48 UTC
I think the term you are looking for is "Recovery Salvage".

http://www.mud.co.uk/richard/hcds.htm Richard Bartle: Players who suit MUDs

Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#3 - 2012-04-17 15:14:09 UTC
Buzzy Warstl wrote:
I think the term you are looking for is "Recovery Salvage".


That's too non-specific. It's not intended to save the ship, just make it's heaping hulk useful a little longer. Zombies can get some serious brain eating done but they're still just walking rot.

If we can have "Energy Vampires" it kind of opens the door for "Vessel Necromancy".
Rek Jaiga
Teraa Matar
#4 - 2012-04-17 15:49:03 UTC
A neat idea, though I can see it being incredibly hard to code and implement. The problem here is just the massive amount of programming needed. How would raised ships behave? I would not want a raised tachyon-fit Oracle to MWD straight towards the enemy, for example!

I do see this as being highly applicable to PvE though! You could simply have the raised ship behave according to the script it did before, but now it aids you instead of shooting at you. Maybe make this apply only to NPCs?
Rek Jaiga
Teraa Matar
#5 - 2012-04-17 15:54:20 UTC
Also, this would rock for Incursions or against Sleepers. Just saying.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#6 - 2012-04-17 16:03:14 UTC
It's a neat idea, but it's not all that good for the game.

Ships need to be lost. In fact, if anything, they need to be lost in larger numbers than they already are, particularly in highsec. Unless each resurrection comes at a cost in materials that pretty much equals the cost to build the ship to begin with, it's directly harmful to industry and to the economy.
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#7 - 2012-04-17 16:07:33 UTC
Rek Jaiga wrote:
How would raised ships behave? I would not want a raised tachyon-fit Oracle to MWD straight towards the enemy, for example!


Drone orders could be constructed for this, which could actually help all drones in general. Set orbit range, if/when to use MWD, run away if taking damage, size priority, choose whether to defend self or owner, if they should return and orbit when done... and these wouldn't have to be individual options, just profiles.
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#8 - 2012-04-17 16:11:30 UTC
Tippia wrote:
It's a neat idea, but it's not all that good for the game.

Ships need to be lost. In fact, if anything, they need to be lost in larger numbers than they already are, particularly in highsec. Unless each resurrection comes at a cost in materials that pretty much equals the cost to build the ship to begin with, it's directly harmful to industry and to the economy.


The hope is for the "ammunition" to be on the scale and price of, say, bombs. And also, this isn't economically harmful at all because these ships are not being restored, just given a short extension of action. This would actually create additional construction because if more items were lost on a second destruction, there would be less to loot from the wreck.

I think a fair duration for lifetime might be... 5 minutes untrained, 15 minutes with max skills. Something like that.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#9 - 2012-04-17 16:13:30 UTC
+1 to removing sparkle-vampires from srs internet spaceships.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#10 - 2012-04-17 16:20:21 UTC
Ok, this would require the Necro-Ship to fit a lot more than a one slot module.

I am thinking the ship would need to compensate for lost CPU and powergrid. These are expected to be damaged beyond control.

Think more along the lines of Necromantic Possession... your little frigate must integrate itself into the hull of the ship it is animating, in order to support and augment the lost or damaged systems the wreck has remaining.

Maybe call it a Ghost Frigate, or something, since in stories ghosts can possess bodies.

The risk vs reward factor could focus on:
RISK, you are gambling your frigate that you can use the wreck zombie to your advantage.
REWARD, you have something expendable to fight with.

I figure the frigate could repower shields, forget armor and structure, and regain the use of any weapons or other subsystems that survived.
Rigs would be a unique benefit, in that they would always be there. The same thing that makes them lost if replaced, and never salvageable, would mean they always would be available to the wreck zombie.

The wreck zombie could never undock in an outpost. The pilot would have to choose between extracting the Ghost Frigate, or fully restoring the animated ship, consuming the frigate in the process.
(Modules used by the wreck zombie would still be mounted in appropriate slots.)

The cost to restore the ship should be the same as a repair bill if the ship docked with no armor and 1% structure.
(For expensive ships, this could be cost effective as a way to get ships)

It would also make wreck retrieval a priority in fleet engagements.
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#11 - 2012-04-17 16:34:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Aphoxema G
I do kind of like the idea of locking onto the wreck's hull instead, but I was thinking something more like the Drone Link Augmentator with the possibility of controlling multiple hulls based on bandwidth like existing drones.

Each "infection launcher" could easily indicate the time you have left to control a wreck, and control could be abandoned by just turning the module off. *And this screws over Necro ships when ECM'd/ damped.

This idea basically came about with the thought of a ship that has very large bandwidth with no drone bay of its own.
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#12 - 2012-04-17 16:36:43 UTC
I also like this idea because it requires maintaining a lock on your marionettes and also the enemies you want to attack, making targeting range and multitasking a key factor and something worth fitting in regard to.
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#13 - 2012-04-17 16:57:29 UTC
http://aphoxema.dyndns.org/enchanter.png

There we go, now you'll understand how amazing it is. Red Navitas.
Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-04-17 19:31:55 UTC
The idea of expanding on this makes me giddy.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Rek Jaiga
Teraa Matar
#15 - 2012-04-17 19:36:16 UTC
Well to be sure, I think that any ships "revived" should act more like drones. Very powerful, scary drones. You could control them for awhile, and perhaps they could even follow you in warp. But they should not jump systems with you or dock, for example.
Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#16 - 2012-04-17 19:39:01 UTC
Rek Jaiga wrote:
Well to be sure, I think that any ships "revived" should act more like drones. Very powerful, scary drones. You could control them for awhile, and perhaps they could even follow you in warp. But they should not jump systems with you or dock, for example.


Oh, dear, no... we don't want to spread zombies around and cause a panic or anything.
Zukes Bla'hati
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2012-04-18 00:22:46 UTC
I love this idea.

I think it would add a very interesting addition to game play.
Katerwaul
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-04-18 02:30:25 UTC
This sounds like something a Rogue Drone might do. Maybe a faction "Hermit Drone" that can be used to Re-purpose the wreck into a weapon or salvage the wreck and retrieve the cargo.
Working with everyone to improve New Eden -- Internet Spaceships Iz Serious Business.
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#19 - 2012-04-18 03:00:28 UTC
In terms of gameplay fluff, it would be hard to implement simply since the ship is wrecked. Power core exploded, etc. Hull so compromized the ship failed. That is really my main issue I would have, story.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.

Aphoxema G
Khushakor Clan
#20 - 2012-04-18 16:37:03 UTC
Markus Reese wrote:
In terms of gameplay fluff, it would be hard to implement simply since the ship is wrecked. Power core exploded, etc. Hull so compromized the ship failed. That is really my main issue I would have, story.


The launcher charge could carry a power core with it (explaining the limited time you can raise a wreck).

Also, it's not terribly clear to what extent ships are made inoperable. You kill the operators, you destroy the power source, you destroy internal connections between systems... there's actually very little destruction that needs to be done to make a ship stop being able to shoot you.