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If is worth it to train the ore processing skills?

Author
LoBlo Fet
Terra-Formers
#1 - 2012-04-08 17:29:23 UTC
Hello.

I have Refining V and Refining efficiency V currently. I was wondering if its worth it to start training the ore refining skills? Right now I can refine at 99.5% efficiency. Do the ore refining skills do anything then?

Thanks
Pierre Despereaux
Cocoseii Spatiali
#2 - 2012-04-08 17:36:04 UTC
yes because it goes toward how much minerals you get from each ore skill you train
you train for velspare you get more trit when you refine as a bonus!
Tekota
The Freighter Factory
#3 - 2012-04-08 17:36:21 UTC
They're potentially useful in that they're prereqs for using specialist mining crystals if that's your thing.

Off the top of my head (and treat this one with a real dollop of salt, it's vague memory only) refining 5, refining efficiency 5 and relevant ore processing skill to just 1 will eradicate refining waste at a 50% NPC station.
Gabbie Tinks
#4 - 2012-04-08 17:36:47 UTC
the ore refining skills are not needed unless your refining at player outposts (0.0 player built stations). Or at a refinery of less than 50%.

with proper faction for tax rate and max base refining skills (not mineral specific) you can reach 100% refine at NPC 50% stations in empire.
LoBlo Fet
Terra-Formers
#5 - 2012-04-08 17:58:30 UTC  |  Edited by: LoBlo Fet
Thanks for the tips.

Gabbie Tinks wrote:
the ore refining skills are not needed unless your refining at player outposts (0.0 player built stations). Or at a refinery of less than 50%.

with proper faction for tax rate and max base refining skills (not mineral specific) you can reach 100% refine at NPC 50% stations in empire.


Thanks for the advice. What is the typical refining rate at a 0.0 POS?
Zifrian
Deep Space Innovations
#6 - 2012-04-08 17:59:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Zifrian
LoBlo Fet wrote:
Gabbie Tinks wrote:
the ore refining skills are not needed unless your refining at player outposts (0.0 player built stations). Or at a refinery of less than 50%.

with proper faction for tax rate and max base refining skills (not mineral specific) you can reach 100% refine at NPC 50% stations in empire.


What is the typical refining rate at a 0.0 POS?

Minmatar stations get 40%. You need level 4 to get perfect refine (not including the station tax, which is usually 10% and you can't remove that with skills).

If the people owning the station were able to put in an upgrade to the others, it's 30% refining.

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Shawn Bolmara
Orbidon Galactic Holdings
#7 - 2012-04-08 18:09:39 UTC
Each of the Ore Processing skill trained to 4 is a requirement IF you eventually want to use Ore Compression Blueprints
Vito Tattaglia
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-04-09 00:01:59 UTC
If you need them for mining crystals, yes.

If you already get the ore otherwise and just refine it, then no.
Styth spiting
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-04-09 09:05:17 UTC
If you want to use the higher quality mining crystals (Arkonor mining crystal II requires refining efficiency V, metallurgy IV) then you will need to higher level refining skills. Same goes with refining Arkonor ores (pretty sure A B C ores require refining efficiency V).

If you're just worried about just high sec mining / refining IIRC you will just need refining V (kernite mining crystals II) and refining efficiency III for perfect yield as well as the related mineral processing skill (kernite processing).
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
#10 - 2012-04-09 10:03:28 UTC
Not needed for perfect refining in high sec. Only needed for using T2 mining crystals and for refining at POS refineries. If you are a serious miner you will want to train to lvl 4 for any ores that you habitually mine to enable use of T2 mining crystals.
LoBlo Fet
Terra-Formers
#11 - 2012-04-10 06:19:10 UTC
So most POSs refine at 40% efficiency?
Lemonmint
Perkone
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-04-10 06:58:21 UTC
LoBlo Fet wrote:
So most POSs refine at 40% efficiency?


A POS refines at 75% efficiency, and this is not effected by any skills, or changeable in any way (POS module "Intensive Refining Array"). An outpost refines are various levels, depending on it's upgrades (I believe the refining is able to be upgraded, it's been awhile), the Minmatar outpost has the highest refine, up to 50%, if upgraded(?). You will be refining at player controlled outposts if you live in 0.0, you typically won't ever refine at a POS.

See http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Outpost for a bit more information about outposts.
LoBlo Fet
Terra-Formers
#13 - 2012-04-10 12:04:19 UTC
Lemonmint wrote:
LoBlo Fet wrote:
So most POSs refine at 40% efficiency?


A POS refines at 75% efficiency, and this is not effected by any skills, or changeable in any way (POS module "Intensive Refining Array"). An outpost refines are various levels, depending on it's upgrades (I believe the refining is able to be upgraded, it's been awhile), the Minmatar outpost has the highest refine, up to 50%, if upgraded(?). You will be refining at player controlled outposts if you live in 0.0, you typically won't ever refine at a POS.

See http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Outpost for a bit more information about outposts.


Oh, I see. Thank you for the information. If players never refine at a POS then how do WH corps refine there ore? Are there outpus in WH?

Thanks
Zifrian
Deep Space Innovations
#14 - 2012-04-10 12:07:49 UTC
No outposts in wh space. Pos refine is a maximum of 75%. Wh corps compress and ship out to empire or just ship out.

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Threshner
#15 - 2012-04-10 13:52:53 UTC
So as a miner without access to a 0.0 POS I shouldn't bother training my processing skills *other than for crystals* because there is no where in HS i can turn minerals into more profit by turning it into building materials. Sounds like its more worth it just to sell my raw ore.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#16 - 2012-04-10 14:34:15 UTC
Lemonmint wrote:
LoBlo Fet wrote:
So most POSs refine at 40% efficiency?


A POS refines at 75% efficiency, and this is not effected by any skills, or changeable in any way (POS module "Intensive Refining Array"). An outpost refines are various levels, depending on it's upgrades (I believe the refining is able to be upgraded, it's been awhile), the Minmatar outpost has the highest refine, up to 50%, if upgraded(?). You will be refining at player controlled outposts if you live in 0.0, you typically won't ever refine at a POS.

See http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Outpost for a bit more information about outposts.



they change that then? I thought it was a 40% base refine (like any other refinery), with a 0.75 yield modifier on top of that...

but then again, I haven't touched them in years.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

LoBlo Fet
Terra-Formers
#17 - 2012-04-10 23:23:15 UTC
Threshner wrote:
So as a miner without access to a 0.0 POS I shouldn't bother training my processing skills *other than for crystals* because there is no where in HS i can turn minerals into more profit by turning it into building materials. Sounds like its more worth it just to sell my raw ore.


I don't understand. If your in highsec then you would have access to a 50% yield station.
Xuixien
Perkone
Caldari State
#18 - 2012-04-11 03:01:43 UTC
Tekota wrote:
They're potentially useful in that they're prereqs for using specialist mining crystals if that's your thing.

Off the top of my head (and treat this one with a real dollop of salt, it's vague memory only) refining 5, refining efficiency 5 and relevant ore processing skill to just 1 will eradicate refining waste at a 50% NPC station.


A quicker way to get there is Refining V, Refinery Efficiency III and level III in whatever ore you're processing. At least, that's what I have trained on my main and all I lose is the NPC tax, which is down to 1% with standings. (It's eliminated entirely at 6.65 standings I believe).

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Gabbie Tinks
#19 - 2012-04-16 00:16:51 UTC
POS player owned station parked at a moon with sheilds, you fuel it and anchor mods to it.... you only refine at this if you have NO OTHER CHOICE it is hard coded to no matter what your skills are have a HUGE LOSS I think 75% is the best yield possible if memory servers

OUTPOST Player built station...(commonly called an egg) that is a permanent structure in eve. (same as a station in hi sec except that it is owned by players and can be conquered. This is where the skills will increase your yield.

NPC station refining under base of 50% here again your skills will pay off.
Tau Cabalander
Yamagata Syndicate
Circle-Of-Two
#20 - 2012-04-16 00:38:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
The material specialization skills are REQUIRED for:
* Level 3: Tech 1 mining crystals
* Level 4: Tech 2 mining crystals
* Level 4: Rorqual Compression BPO

If you only refine, you can get away without the material specialization skills by using a 2% refining implant (RX-802). It uses slot 8.

In hisec you can get away with
* 50% base facilities + Refining 5 + Refinery Efficiency 3 + Material Specialization 2
* 50% base facilities + Refining 5 + Refinery Efficiency 4 + Material Specialization 1
As you don't usually need to refine Arkonor, Bistot, Crokite, Mercoxit, Dark Ochre, Gneiss, Hedbergite, or Spoudumain.

If you refine in 0.0 at a 35% base Minmatar outpost without upgrades, then you want them at 5 and a 4% refining implant (RX-804) for 99.35% yield.

A note on POS refining arrays: they are rubbish for anything other than ice. Skills affect them, but they have a yield cap on ore, example: intensive = 75% yield. They are only good for refining ice (Ice Processing 1 = 100% yield).

Yield (before tax) = MINIMUM(100%, Facilities Base + Reprocessing Base * (1 + Refining * 0.02) * (1 + Refinery Efficiency * 0.04) * (1 + Material Specialization * 0.05) * (1 + Refining Implant Percent / 100))

Facilities Base: Depends on the station
Reprocessing Base: 37.5% for NPC stations and outposts

Tax Percent ("We Keep" column) = MAXIMUM(0, 5 - standing * 0.75)

The "Unrecoverable" column is from poor skills or facilities.
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