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EVE economics, care bears, pirates

Author
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#41 - 2012-04-07 22:33:57 UTC
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

It's not hard to know who the most high-profile griefers are, and getting rid of them would give less inspiration to the moderates.

It wouldn't eradicate ganking, but it would severly curtail it.

... come at me, bro?
Meryl SinGarda
Belligerent Underpaid Tactical Team
#42 - 2012-04-07 22:34:49 UTC
blackbugsblood wrote:
maybe you should make your own super safe space game. im sure it would be a great success


WHAT IN THE HELL. FACE? YOUR!
Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#43 - 2012-04-07 23:01:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Chokichi Ozuwara
Vyl Vit wrote:
There's no reason in the world why the five major types of play in EVE can't continue unabated. The place is big enough with room to spare. Calling yourself a "ganker" probably makes you feel pretty cool. But, people who "gank" have been with us since we came out of the trees. There's no special talent to it. Find someone who can't defend themselves and torture them to feel some internal gratification that resonates like the Beevis and Butthead snigger. We dealt with them then...just yank a knot in the top of their heads, and keep an eye on them. If they continue...well, it's not a pretty sight, but for the greater good, and nobody was cryin' at the "loss". So, these morons found a place on the internet where they can "virtually" do it, get their snigger, and nobody can smack 'em upside the head. Whoopteedoo. Let me know when you think of something new.

The crime/punishment dynamic of EVE does much to if not prevent this sort of perennial turd in the punchbowl, make them pay for doing it. But, it can do much more. If CCP likes its money, when it errs, it best err on the side of the credit card. When we "play" we're supposed to be having "FUN." Gankers may be having their poor excuse for fun, but it's obviously one-sided. If they're ten percent of the population, it's a ten percent CCP can indeed do without. (Gankers have a hard time with math. They can't comprehend one person driving ten people to finding something else to do. Those ten telling a friend who has it all their way here, making 20 who don't pay, while the ganker pays in PLEX.) This isn't difficult to understand...unless you're a ganker, and those people don't understand much anyway. You'll be able to tell by their eloquent responses on this thread...hint, hint.

The main question is: Why aren't gankers out in low and null sec attacking people that can ably fight back? That's obvious enough, too. They're CHICKEN. They suck at the game, and they'd have their @$$3$ handed to them by people who actually KNOW how to fight, and win. They'd rather pad a killboard for their adolescently-minded buddies to gurgle over. Considering they can't get dates, and have nothing to brag about in that arena, you can see why this is a big deal to them, of course. If you want to GANK somebody, please...man up and gank somebody in Bosena, or Amamake. Those who know don't have to say, those who don't say "Huh? Wha?"

Hi / Lo / Null There's plenty of people doing what you like to do. Go do it with them and put some real challenge in your life. OR, pick on defenseless n00bs and be seen as the Beavis and Buttheads you are. We all make choices in life.

CCP needs to choose either money, or sophomoric behavior. So far, they've proven to be pretty sophmoric themselves.

It's nice to see an intelligent post from someone who "gets it".

With CCP teaming up with Sony, we're about to see massive growth in Eve from the DUST born rather than childish idiots from anti-social niche communities.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.

Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#44 - 2012-04-07 23:06:35 UTC
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.

Adunh Slavy
#45 - 2012-04-07 23:48:52 UTC
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.



Sure there is, He's a simple one, allow anyone that is +2 or above shoot anyone that is -2 or below. Have this not be considered a criminal act. Guess what will happen, the gankers will cry and bleat and scream about how concord doesn't protect them enough.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt

Htrag
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone
#46 - 2012-04-08 01:46:58 UTC
Speaking for the -10 contingent.... we simply pop whatever is presented to us... hauler... fraction battleship its all good.

If u cant hack getting your uninsured crap ganked because you jumped unscouted into lowsec, we didn't want you any way.

Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game.

Htrag
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone
#47 - 2012-04-08 01:51:06 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:


The main question is: Why aren't gankers out in low and null sec attacking people that can ably fight back? That's obvious enough, too. They're CHICKEN. They suck at the game, and they'd have their @$$3$ handed to them by people who actually KNOW how to fight, and win.


Well because we simply blow you up regardless because we're better.

Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game.

Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#48 - 2012-04-08 01:56:04 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Vyl Vit wrote:



And Other Urban Myths...let me know when your book comes out.



SOE made SWG safe for all. It died a month later.


Really? So all that time is wasnt dead from when the NGE etc came out till what last November were imaginary?
Drastically reduced population, yes, dead, not from what I saw

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#49 - 2012-04-08 01:56:10 UTC
Gunrunner1775 wrote:
present a logical counter argument then, im more then willing to listen to all sides

EVE Online has seen continued subscription growth since launch.

There, I just defeated your arguments in one stroke.

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]

Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#50 - 2012-04-08 01:59:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Hammond II
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.



Sure there is, He's a simple one, allow anyone that is +2 or above shoot anyone that is -2 or below. Have this not be considered a criminal act. .


hell yes

Lapine Davion wrote:
Gunrunner1775 wrote:
present a logical counter argument then, im more then willing to listen to all sides

EVE Online has seen continued subscription growth since launch.

There, I just defeated your arguments in one stroke.


So that flat spot ppl were bitching about during the summer of rage and all the graphs and such they showed that had a plateau where there used to be growth here were wrong then?

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Htrag
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone
#51 - 2012-04-08 02:00:30 UTC
Richard Hammond II wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.



Sure there is, He's a simple one, allow anyone that is +2 or above shoot anyone that is -2 or below. Have this not be considered a criminal act. .


hell yes


You're just talking about a game machanic change that wont make you any better. All things being equal you still get blowed up.

Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game.

Htrag
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone
#52 - 2012-04-08 02:04:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Htrag
Gunrunner1775 wrote:
im not saying get rid of PVP, but i am saying that the implimentation of the security measures to protect players from ganking/greifing or what ever you want to call it have been poorly implimented. its hard to stop a suicide bomber


Well you could use basic situational awareness which applies to every second you're in space anywhere.

Advocating crippling the fundamental basics of what makes eve unique just makes you weak and lazy.

Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game.

Jita Alt666
#53 - 2012-04-08 02:10:11 UTC
OP:

The typical MMO market is not the Eve market:
1. Eve is the only product that relies on a player driven economy
2. Eve is the only single shard game with over 5000 people online simultaneously
3. Eve is the only game where you are not safe anywhere
Comparing Eve Online to other MMO's leads one to make false connections. CCP learned this almost 10 months ago.

CCP is a thriving company (when they do not over invest in other products). A thriving niche company does not need to nor should it aspire to become the biggest thing out. Eve fills a niche market. It does so well enough to almost have a complete monopoly on that market. By attempting to become the biggest MMO out (you compared the game to WOW by stating Blizzard is successful and then stating CCP need to survive) CCP will lose their roots. Eve will not be Eve any more just another lame wow clone.

Jita Alt666
#54 - 2012-04-08 02:12:24 UTC
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.



Sure there is, He's a simple one, allow anyone that is +2 or above shoot anyone that is -2 or below. Have this not be considered a criminal act. Guess what will happen, the gankers will cry and bleat and scream about how concord doesn't protect them enough.



+2 - -2 is to close.

+5 - -5 works much better. You want to kill baddies grind your way up, just like the baddies have to do if they want to lose their -10.
Panacani
Doomheim
#55 - 2012-04-08 02:14:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Panacani
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.



Sure there is, He's a simple one, allow anyone that is +2 or above shoot anyone that is -2 or below. Have this not be considered a criminal act. Guess what will happen, the gankers will cry and bleat and scream about how concord doesn't protect them enough.


Creates a whole new career in Eve and puts the onus on the carebear to protect his own. Best idea I've read on these forums in ever.

This idea should have it's own thread.
Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#56 - 2012-04-08 02:14:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Kessiaan
Gunrunner1775 wrote:
It is a well-known that casual gamers (and for the most part, the care bears are casual gamers) are the DOMINANT population in the MMO community.


This is a myth. All of WoW's contemporaries save EvE killed themselves trying to court casual gamers who weren't interested in playing anything other than WoW. Every AAA MMO that's come since WoW has failed to live up to expectations because they aggressively courted a casual market that was only interested in playing WoW. Even WoW is in decline now because the casual market is no longer interested in it, and by extension MMOs in general.

EvE is still standing (thriving even, for the most part) because of what it is, not in spite of it. And the MMO market is slowly returning to what it was before 2004, which I don't think is a bad thing necessarily.
Rory Orlenard
Eve Pilots Revolutionary Army
#57 - 2012-04-08 02:15:15 UTC
I've been waiting for this post..thank you ! Eve being a universe where all players are on one server means that there is an upper limit on how many accounts can be active at one time, even with the progress CCP has made.
Eve is also a different game then the popular mmo's and that is not an accident. My opinion on this matter is that CCP doesn't want to be a WoW mmo, they keep track of how many subscribers they have and the current trend in subscriptions. CCP probably knows it's maximum users and really doesn't want more. ( A good reason for another game - such as Dust to expand and increase revenue.)
CCP watches comers and goers and balances that with thier "optimum" Eve accounts. When Eve was in trouble after Incarnagate Hilmar reacted. I don't think Eve is in danger of turning into WoW or in danger of dieing - because there will always be a certain number of people who find thier way past the usual WoW clone.
Pretty much what you have with Eve is a niche game for a limited number of sick bastards like us that balances itself.
Thomas Orca
Broski is ded
#58 - 2012-04-08 02:21:59 UTC
Jita Alt666 wrote:



+5 - -5 works much better. You want to kill baddies grind your way up, just like the baddies have to do if they want to lose their -10.

Oh wait it's already like that but without the grinding!
Htrag
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone
#59 - 2012-04-08 02:22:58 UTC
Panacani wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Then do it. Civilize highsec.

Impossible. The game mechanics allow for ganking, they don't allow for civilizing.

There is no lasting consequence to someone who ganks. But being ganked has consequences that cannot be avoided.



Sure there is, He's a simple one, allow anyone that is +2 or above shoot anyone that is -2 or below. Have this not be considered a criminal act. Guess what will happen, the gankers will cry and bleat and scream about how concord doesn't protect them enough.


Creates a whole new career in Eve and puts the onus on the carebear to protect his own. Best idea I've read on these forums in ever.

This idea should have it's own thread.


You know what I love about Eve?.

Theres so many carebears and moral justice advocates that try to apply some type of different logic how the game actually works, particularly in regards to their own shortcomings.

"If I can't survive, lets change the rules"

No dude, harden yourself up or find a new game. That's how we roll.

Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game.

Jita Alt666
#60 - 2012-04-08 02:25:17 UTC
Thomas Orca wrote:
Jita Alt666 wrote:



+5 - -5 works much better. You want to kill baddies grind your way up, just like the baddies have to do if they want to lose their -10.

Oh wait it's already like that but without the grinding!


Oh it works fine with a neutral orca alt in system. Just when you wanna cruise around mindlessly it gets harder.