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Announcing the Officers of CSM 7

First post
Author
Courthouse
Perkone
Caldari State
#61 - 2012-04-05 12:57:11 UTC
Tahnil wrote:
From a political and psychological perspective it was a great error to NOT elect Two Step as a chairman. The CSM had already lost a great deal of its legitimation by the dismissal of The Mittani right at the beginning of the new election period. By choosing one of the weaker runner-ups and not the second in vote, legitimation has not been restored in the least, but further eroded.


Heh, not only that, but the guy who is responsible for Dominion sov system, the rise of the megacoalition, nullsec decay and supercaps online.

I went and bought a couple of those 5 gallon tins of popcorn for this CSM session because these idiots are going to be nothing if not entertaining.
Oxandrolone
Interstellar Enterprise Inc.
Collapsed Out.
#62 - 2012-04-05 13:30:12 UTC
Well even if the csm guidelines state

Quote:
If the Chairman decides to step down or rescind his responsibility at any time for any reason, a vote must be held among representatives to elect another Chairman.” (page 16 of white paper)


its still a shame that the chairman was not elected by the eve community this csm. instead he was voted by the other cms's who were looking for a chairman that best represented their interests as opposed to the person who was voted in by the community.
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2012-04-05 13:36:33 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
While they are hiding behind the white paper to make a fairly blatant power grab away from Two Step, I have a dirty little secret for all y'all.

There was no power-grab. CCP made a decision about how things should proceed (and I, in fact, argued that everyone should just shift up one place and thus the chairman's position should go to Two Step by default)

Quote:
The chairman position is meaningless and is a holdover from the old days when voting happened in formal meetings in some dumb irc channel. There is no real power in the Chair that any member of the CSM can't claim for themselves by posting, chatting, doing interviews.

Good to see you agree with what I was saying during the elections.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#64 - 2012-04-05 13:43:01 UTC
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
While they are hiding behind the white paper to make a fairly blatant power grab away from Two Step, I have a dirty little secret for all y'all.

There was no power-grab. CCP made a decision about how things should proceed (and I, in fact, argued that everyone should just shift up one place and thus the chairman's position should go to Two Step by default)



Quote:
CSM 7 Chairman - Seleene

Because of the resignation of The Mittani from CSM 7, the position of Chairman was opened up to a vote among all 13 members of CSM 7. The candidates were Two Step and Seleene. The votes:

Meissa Anunthiel - Seleene
Greene Lee - Seleene
Two Step - Two Step
Kelduum Revaan - Seleene
Alekseyev Karrde - Seleene
Hans Jagerblitzen - Seleene
Elise Randolph - Seleene
UAxDEATH - Seleene
Seleene - Seleene
Trebor Daehdoow - Seleene
Dovinian - Seleene
Issler Dainze - Two Step
Darius III - Seleene





Quote:
Good to see you agree with what I was saying during the elections.


You know I did :) I was pretty darn vocal about it too.
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#65 - 2012-04-05 13:51:28 UTC
Tahnil wrote:
From a political and psychological perspective it was a great error to NOT elect Two Step as a chairman. The CSM had already lost a great deal of its legitimation by the dismissal of The Mittani right at the beginning of the new election period. By choosing one of the weaker runner-ups and not the second in vote, legitimation has not been restored in the least, but further eroded.

The community shall have a very close look at all steps that are being taken by CSM 7. To my mind CSM 7 elections were very much about the »nerf supercaps issue«, and The Mittani was the impressive winner of the elections. You can only interpret this result as (1) a tribute to how he managed affairs in the past year and (2) a clear mandate to CSM 7 to proceed in the footsteps of The Mittanis political agenda. If CSM 7 should try to reverse the accomplishments of CSM 6 with regards to supercaps and other issues, then the election of Seleene will be regarded as a real coup d'état, and a true mockery of the voter's will.

Good luck, Seleene. You took a heavy burden by running for chairman, and your chairmanship is already overshadowed.

And @Two Step: don't let yourself be fobbed off by »one of the most demanding posts on the CSM«. You got a clear mandate to take a leadership position in CSM 7. Don't let that be overshadowed by a technicality like this unfortunate chairman election.


As Vile Rat correctly said, Chairman is a largely ceremonial title. I do feel that I deserved it, given that I was in 2nd place by a fairly large margin and by my actions on CSM 6, but clearly most of the council disagreed. I intend to go ahead with my priorities and to make CSM 7 much more open and transparent to the community, which I think was one of the major mistakes of CSM 6.

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog

Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#66 - 2012-04-05 14:07:03 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
There was no power-grab. CCP made a decision about how things should proceed (and I, in fact, argued that everyone should just shift up one place and thus the chairman's position should go to Two Step by default)

[quote]CSM 7 Chairman - Seleene
...
Trebor Daehdoow - Seleene
...

So? I made the argument that because Alex resigned before he was a seated member of CSM7, he was never a member of CSM7, so Two step was the top vote-getter, and the chair was his if he wanted it. I preferred this because it eliminated stupid drama like this thread.

CCP disagreed, saying that he was a member of CSM7 as soon as he was elected. Thus we had to have an election.

That being the case, I now had to decide who was best suited to each role. Choosing between Seleene and Two step was an edge decision, but given the declared goals of the various people, and especially Two step's desire to increase transparency and do more communications work, I felt that Seleene as chairman and Two step as secretary was the best combination.

I stepped down from secretary to make that possible.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Tahnil
Gunboat Commando
#67 - 2012-04-05 14:08:30 UTC
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
While they are hiding behind the white paper to make a fairly blatant power grab away from Two Step, I have a dirty little secret for all y'all.

There was no power-grab. CCP made a decision about how things should proceed (and I, in fact, argued that everyone should just shift up one place and thus the chairman's position should go to Two Step by default)


Then why tf did you vote for Seleene?
Vile rat
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#68 - 2012-04-05 14:09:26 UTC
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
There was no power-grab. CCP made a decision about how things should proceed (and I, in fact, argued that everyone should just shift up one place and thus the chairman's position should go to Two Step by default)

[quote]CSM 7 Chairman - Seleene
...
Trebor Daehdoow - Seleene
...

So? I made the argument that because Alex resigned before he was a seated member of CSM7, he was never a member of CSM7, so Two step was the top vote-getter, and the chair was his if he wanted it. I preferred this because it eliminated stupid drama like this thread.

CCP disagreed, saying that he was a member of CSM7 as soon as he was elected. Thus we had to have an election.

That being the case, I now had to decide who was best suited to each role. Choosing between Seleene and Two step was an edge decision, but given the declared goals of the various people, and especially Two step's desire to increase transparency and do more communications work, I felt that Seleene as chairman and Two step as secretary was the best combination.

I stepped down from secretary to make that possible.


Nice try Robert. If you think it should go to Two step you had it in your power to influence it this way. You say one thing do another.

Mitt Daehdoow.
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2012-04-05 14:16:51 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
Nice try Robert. If you think it should go to Two step you had it in your power to influence it this way. You say one thing do another.

I am amused by your fumbling attempt to misrepresent my position.

New circumstances require new decisions. I would have preferred not to have had to made a decision, but once I had to, I made the call I felt was best for the CSM.

And btw, Seleene made the same argument to CCP that I did prior to them making the decision that they had to be an election. Ask Two step if you don't believe me.

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Prince Kobol
#70 - 2012-04-05 14:40:46 UTC
What, Vile rat, a Goon trying to misrepresent somebodies position.. well I never Shocked
Zedah Zoid
Good Eats
#71 - 2012-04-05 14:52:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Zedah Zoid
Seleene wrote:
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Two step wrote:
CSM 7 Chairman - Seleene

C/D Seleene was overheard at fanfest discussing/advocating some "unnamed" mechanic to put more mass/time on wormholes?

GL Two-Step.


Yeah, that was the T3 Super Titans. Since they are modular, you can configure them specifically to do different things (combat, industry, exploration, etc...). Each configuration is very versitile seeing as how there are seven sub-systems. One of the exploration configurations allows you to place a 'Mass Generator' at each end of a Super Titan. You then fly the Super Titan into a wormhole and use the mid-ship sub-system to 'anchor' the ship in transit. Once this is done, you essentially have half of the Super Titan in the wormhole and outside of it in normal space. You then activate the mass generators on each end of the titan, thus creating a stabilization effect that keeps the wormhole from collapsing.

It's a very expensive solution but quite involved and awesome. Smile

There, now you have a name for it. Enjoy!


April 1st was earlier this week. :notsureifserious: Shocked

Absolutely sure this is the worst idea I've heard in Eve possibly ever. Congrats on the chairmanship btw.

Two step, keep him in line!

Edit: The more I think about this the more I think I'm being trolled. But the congrats and the admonition to keep you in line are still truth. :)
Teemo Is-OP
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#72 - 2012-04-05 16:06:45 UTC
Seleene wrote:
Dorn Val wrote:
There are two things that make W space special: No one shows up in local unless they are stupid enough to talk in it, and mass limits on worm holes. As someone who lives in W space I don't want to see either of those two things changed. Thank God Two Step is still on the CSM!


A few fun WH facts:

* No local was almost not a feature; a last stand of sorts took by CCP Greyscale and myself place to make sure it stayed in place.
* Same thing with CONCORD being in C1-C2 class WH's. Can you imagine?
* The 'mass' mechanics came about because I was right in the middle of re-reading the Honor Harrington books.

As an aside, if you've never seen my presentation at FanFest in 2009, the first few minutes of it show the actual Powerpoint slides that our team used to 'sell' the WH feature to the executive board:

EVE Online Fanfest 2009 - Game Design Retrospective



So, by doing your job (and fulfilling promises to the people who voted for you) by representing, as best you can, ALL players in New Eden, you think you're entitled to shut some else out because you were more involved at one point than someone else?

Titans are broken. You know it, Titan Pilots know it, CCP, and everyone else (who reads about this stuff) knows it. So lets go ahead and make a new one, that can go into a wormhole and blap stuff there too.

I'm not too keen on how sov works, but don't you need sov to build a titan or supercap? So the only people who be able to build these T3 Super Titans would be OUTSIDE of wormholes. OR you can just introduce sov. (another broken mechanic) into wormholes (one of the only decently stable mechanics in EVE) so that Wormholers can introduce another broken mechanic (Titans) into wormholes.

TLDR: Seleene wants NEW T3 Super Titans (Broken) to be put into Wormholes (Not Nearly as Broken) so she can her Fap - err Blap on where she has no business
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#73 - 2012-04-05 16:22:24 UTC
Hey now, calm down. That WAS a joke by Seleene. At least I'm pretty sure it was...

.

Pallidum Treponema
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#74 - 2012-04-05 16:27:32 UTC
I for one am looking forward to acquiring 10058 supertitans.
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#75 - 2012-04-05 16:43:04 UTC
Vile rat wrote:
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
Vile rat wrote:
While they are hiding behind the white paper to make a fairly blatant power grab away from Two Step, I have a dirty little secret for all y'all.

There was no power-grab. CCP made a decision about how things should proceed (and I, in fact, argued that everyone should just shift up one place and thus the chairman's position should go to Two Step by default)



Quote:
CSM 7 Chairman - Seleene

Because of the resignation of The Mittani from CSM 7, the position of Chairman was opened up to a vote among all 13 members of CSM 7. The candidates were Two Step and Seleene. The votes:

Meissa Anunthiel - Seleene
Greene Lee - Seleene
Two Step - Two Step
Kelduum Revaan - Seleene
Alekseyev Karrde - Seleene
Hans Jagerblitzen - Seleene
Elise Randolph - Seleene
UAxDEATH - Seleene
Seleene - Seleene
Trebor Daehdoow - Seleene
Dovinian - Seleene
Issler Dainze - Two Step
Darius III - Seleene





Quote:
Good to see you agree with what I was saying during the elections.


You know I did :) I was pretty darn vocal about it too.




You know its good to see one of the proposals made to CSM1 finally coming to fruition "a fully voted chair position" even if it was as a result of some extraordinary circumstances and timing fluke. I wonder if the current CSM would agree that having this kind of thing written into the whitepaper for the future might be sensible. That way we could always ensure the Chair had the support of a majority of the CSM (and thus majority of the voting electorate) and avoid having edge-candidates without the general interests of the game at heart occupying this important PR position.



The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom

Orisa Medeem
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#76 - 2012-04-05 18:17:24 UTC
I'd like to understand how the candidates for each position were selected.

For instance, for the chairman position I would expect that the eligible members would be either:
- 2nd and 3rd, that is, Two Step and Elise
- 2nd to 7th, that is, Two Step, Elise, Greene Lee, Trebor, Kelduum, Seleene

I just don't understand why it was restricted to Two Step and Seleene. The same goes for the other positions.

:sand:  over  :awesome:

Dry Martinis
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#77 - 2012-04-05 18:28:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Dry Martinis
FrFrmPukin wrote:
Super Titans???? This is what the CSM panel has to offer already .. I miss OVEGlove already.. :sadface:



Much agreed, what a sad start......



Terrorfrodo wrote:
To summarize:
1. The candidate who got almost as many votes as the three next best candidates is not on the CSM
2. The second-placed candidate was spurned by all of the CSM except its most annoying member for the position of chairman in favor of the seventh-placed candidate

The reasons for No. 1 are known. No. 2 truly baffles me. I was under the impression that Two Step has been a widely respected member of CSM 6. Is it because he was too close to The Mittani (who seemed to assume that Two Step would be chairman), and the rest of the gang feel that it's finally their moment in the light, now that the Emperor has been pulled down?

I guess there won't be any honest information about any of this in this thread. Maybe someone can direct me to other sources.

Anyway, this CSM is a farce. Those who lost the election are now in complete control of the CSM. And they're guys from proven RMT alliances, no less.



Also agreed, This CSM is just a joke. Seleene, you do not represent us because we did not vote for you. No matter how much you try to tell yourself different. Though PL may have the botting and RMT resources to fund this, we don't and now you propose a way to keep WH's locked open.....Supertitans..........What a joke already....

CAPS LOCK: CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL.

Teemo Is-OP
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#78 - 2012-04-05 18:28:40 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
Hey now, calm down. That WAS a joke by Seleene. At least I'm pretty sure it was...


I hope so, but Seleene has made too many "jokes" that have needed to be clarified as "jokes" regarding Titans. Seleene needs to just stop talking about them unless she's serious. I think that should go for all the CSM members.
Dry Martinis
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#79 - 2012-04-05 18:30:57 UTC
Teemo Is-OP wrote:
Terrorfrodo wrote:
Hey now, calm down. That WAS a joke by Seleene. At least I'm pretty sure it was...


I hope so, but Seleene has made too many "jokes" that have needed to be clarified as "jokes" regarding Titans. Seleene needs to just stop talking about them unless she's serious. I think that should go for all the CSM members.



Yeah, enough "jokes" sounds to me like you make a joke to see which one gets the least outcry. Only joke here is how Seleene ended up as chairman.

CAPS LOCK: CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL.

Pallidum Treponema
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#80 - 2012-04-05 19:09:47 UTC
Dry Martinis wrote:

Also agreed, This CSM is just a joke. Seleene, you do not represent us because we did not vote for you. No matter how much you try to tell yourself different. Though PL may have the botting and RMT resources to fund this, we don't and now you propose a way to keep WH's locked open.....Supertitans..........What a joke already....


Butthurt much?

I didn't vote for Mittani either, nor did I vote for Trebor, Two Step, Hans, UAxDEATH or Darius. This is how democracies work.

PS: The 15T PL isk was a troll. You fell for it. Guess what supetitans are. ;)