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fanfest faction warfare = datacores
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Han Mizrachi
Verum Legio
#21 - 2012-03-24 15:57:55 UTC
Moving RP to FW doesn't fit in line with the fact many players grind out standings with all 4 races research corps, and therefore have good faction standing with all races. Although i do agree that the almost completely passive income is bad. Another point to add about FW datacores, say Caldari have more researchers than Gallente, surely its plausible that Gallente T2 ship prices could rise without affecting other races T2 ship prices... which seems bad?!

Personally i would have CCP create a whole new set of missions for R&D agents and have the ISK/LP reward replaced by RP or by actual datacores. This way budding researchers could actually use lvl 1/2/3 R&D agents to grind their standings as well. Makes the process of obtaining them active and stops researchers having to stick to one race as per the FW route.
Thawed Corpse
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2012-03-24 16:20:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Thawed Corpse
CCP could also make tech II BPOs available as FW LP purchases. Just make them really expensive, so that they reduce the value of existing tech II bpo over time. As long as they are messing with one part of the invention market for tech II why stop with just datacores? I don't want to lose part of my passive income from datacores, unless I feel that someone who gains from the exact same endpoint (tech II bpc) also loses some value. If the pain is spread around to everyone, then it is easier to accept.

Also, making tech II bpo available through LP purchase would also reduce the value of datacores over time, so that at some time later both bpo and datacores are worth a lot less. I know how some people will go crazy at the idea of losing value of bpo that they accumulated. However the problem of existing bpo being around to mess up the other people trying to do invention has been around for a lot longer time, and that problem should probably be taken care of prior to worrying about other peoples' passive income.

Alternatively, we could just take all the tech II bpo out of existence at the same time that the datacore changes are made, so that as extra ways of acquiring datacores are added, so is the demand for them increased.
Ameron Phinard
#23 - 2012-03-24 17:32:48 UTC
Thawed Corpse wrote:
CCP could also make tech II BPOs available as FW LP purchases. Just make them really expensive, so that they reduce the value of existing tech II bpo over time.


Or crater the market and unbalance the game.
Tebb1288
Firework Industries
#24 - 2012-03-24 20:01:25 UTC
This is an absurd change. Faction Warfare should have nothing to do with tech 2 production. Sounds they wanted a way to nerf the passive income of datacores and just picked the first section of the game they redesigned to stick a new datacore method in.

If they wanted to nerf passive datacores they should remove the passive aspect, remove the cap on one mission per agent per day, and significantly increase the rp reward per datacore. Possibly tying the missions into industry, such as turning in X amount of tech 1 ship for Y amount of datacores. That would at least make sense to have an agent accept tech 1 and reward a key item to make tech 2, rather than the process be blowing up members of another faction for th ekey item for tech 2.
Nekopyat
Nee-Co
#25 - 2012-03-26 13:49:40 UTC
From the interview, it sounds like they want to tie datacores to FW so they can vary the price of cores by domiance, thus giving the players an incentive to balance FW for them, which could actually work.

The mechanic has potential, but it feels like bit of robbing peter to pay paul, and industry/PvE players are getting a little tired of always being peter, so this feels like another 'well, if you do not pew-pew then you are playing our game wrong, so we want to use your stuff to balance another area of the game'.

However, it also sounds like they have some new industry stuff in the pipline for Inferno, so we might get some new toys too. It sounds like they are doing some serious rebalancing of the economy which will, of course, produce winners and losers. I would not call myself cautiously optimistic,.. but at least cautiously curious.

I will, I admit, miss drone poo in missions. Hopefully it will be balanced with some more interesting high sec mining. There were hints that they were going to have some new ship based mechanic for harvesting T2 materials, but they might make it low/null only which would suck.
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#26 - 2012-03-26 17:33:34 UTC
Bennet Am wrote:
As I recall. The datacores in question were faction starship engineering.


This seems like a bad idea. As it stands now, very few t2 ships are profitable if you have to buy the materials. If the datacores to invent increase in cost, the number of profitable t2 ships drops further.
Marbuel
Australian Belt Strippers
#27 - 2012-03-27 02:58:23 UTC
Having the four factional starship research datacores available from factional conflict makes more sense than the entire range, but I'm still not chuffed with the idea overall.
DigDoug
Bare Minimum Bandits
I Showed You My Probes... Please Respond...
#28 - 2012-03-27 04:28:12 UTC
Let FW have datacores and make fleet stabber bpcs randomly pop out of veldspar.

Fair trade and makes as much sense.
Tobiaz
Spacerats
#29 - 2012-03-27 11:18:30 UTC
I don't like moving the datacores to FW. I understand CCP wants FW to influence the rest of EVE and I wholeheartedly agree.

But datacores belong to the NPC research-companies and research agents. Yes they are too much of an ATM right now, but it deserves its own solution. Not tossing it into the FW pit, just to get rid of the problem.

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Nekopyat
Nee-Co
#30 - 2012-03-27 15:51:23 UTC
DigDoug wrote:
Let FW have datacores and make fleet stabber bpcs randomly pop out of veldspar.

Fair trade and makes as much sense.


Hrm... you know... randomly finding 'stuff' in some 'roids could be interesting. Add some kind of optional archeology component to mining.
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#31 - 2012-03-28 20:49:59 UTC
Nekopyat wrote:
DigDoug wrote:
Let FW have datacores and make fleet stabber bpcs randomly pop out of veldspar.

Fair trade and makes as much sense.


Hrm... you know... randomly finding 'stuff' in some 'roids could be interesting. Add some kind of optional archeology component to mining.


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Kirith Vespira
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#32 - 2012-03-28 22:14:54 UTC
Mavnas wrote:
Borun Tal wrote:
Lady Naween wrote:
in the faction warfare they said they where looking at (nothing set in stone) that they wanted to move datacores to the faction warfare militia store instead of our current system.

seems like an interesting system.. not sure what i think atm myself...


Link, please.


So massive skill points for a small amount of passive income -> massive skill points for a miniscule amount of passive income. Well, that's at least one account I need to cancel, possibly two.


Or just join FW... good fun for people that aren't scared of low sec...
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#33 - 2012-03-29 00:18:52 UTC
CCP Soundwave "Mining with guns in Dronelands makes no sense....R&D in empire with guns is totally awesome!"

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
Kiwi Momaki
Doomheim
#34 - 2012-03-29 01:53:42 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:
CCP Soundwave "Mining with guns in Dronelands makes no sense....R&D in empire with guns is totally awesome!"



Rofl and also makes no sense...
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2012-03-29 23:38:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Hakaru Ishiwara
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Issler Dainze wrote:
So what would an R&D agent be used for I wonder?

Issler



Reduction, not removal.

As long as the market value doesn't change significantly, I'm not too bothered. I'm not a huge fan of almost entirely passive income.
The accumulation of datacores may be passive outside of gathering them all up, but the path taken to level IV R&D agents was far from passive and took a fairly decent amount of both training and mission running.

Furthermore, Datacores still have to be sold on the market in order to generate liquidity for the player. There has to be a demand in order for any sort of direct income to take place.

Datacore pricing has, in some cases, dropped greatly in the past few years, significantly diminishing the value of the time spent grinding up the R&D agents. And when put up against the ever increasing prices and cost of doing business in EVE, the income levels aren't all that great relative to, say, 3 - 4 years ago... or relative to the current rate of return from high-sec Incursions.

Am I crying poor? Only so much as to communicate that datacore harvesting isn't the insanely good cash cow it once was.

+++++++ I have never shed a tear for a fellow EVE player until now. Mark “Seleene” Heard's Blog Honoring Sean "Vile Rat" Smith.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2012-03-31 07:30:02 UTC
It was a Soundwave interview; he stated that this was the plan but not set in stone.. and that RP would be harder to earn. and that faction warfare would control the pricing of the datacores depending on which faction controlled the more territory. He hinted that you should cash in your RP for datacores before the next expansion.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

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Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#37 - 2012-04-05 03:33:40 UTC
bump, because it looks like CCP is going to go forward with this plan
Brock Nelson
#38 - 2012-04-05 04:02:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Brock Nelson
http://pastebin.com/mCYEhc4G

Latest database change suggests that CCP is removing the ability to purchase datacore but doesn't seem to indicate if the ability to generate RP is affected.

Signature removed, CCP Phantom
AFK Hauler
State War Academy
#39 - 2012-04-05 23:44:49 UTC
I do not like this idea... T2 everything will increase in price.

The analogy of an ATM to print ISK is not true as this does not introduce new ISK into the game. It transfers ISK between players and supplies the market with T2 manufacturing goods.

[Proposal]
Allow the R&D to sell datacores at the increased price as discussed

AND

Sell BPCs for Data cores that can be manufactured using PI materials for the cheaper price.


This will allow for two mechanisms to supply the market - direct and indirect


Otherwise it's poor form for CCP to completely slap players in the face who chose to play by manufacturing to be told that all those combat skills they passed on are now needed to farm datacores to manufacturer at the current rate.

If they implement this idea without compensation like BPCs, then I would actually be in favor of total skill point reset for research characters so they can apply those research skill points into combat.
Not sure if many people realize just how big this change might be for EVE and T2 items.
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#40 - 2012-04-06 00:28:38 UTC
Brock Nelson wrote:
http://pastebin.com/mCYEhc4G

Latest database change suggests that CCP is removing the ability to purchase datacore but doesn't seem to indicate if the ability to generate RP is affected.


too bad no one trust you anymore

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
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